After an initial answer from gigablue about this problem they have been quiet since, so i had a fiddle myself, i am using an openatv 6.3 image from october last year which is working how it should do, not ideal i know but at the moment i'm not sure gigablue will do anything about it, as on the gigablue forum there is quite a few members who have had the problem for some time, it seems VU+ boxes don't have this problem with unicable, i like using the unicable lnb so i may get a new box.