abu baniaz
Moderator
While the iron is hot, can we code a fake recording timer so we don't have to use EPG refresh plugin?
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[ViX_Misc] Zap timer problem
- Thread starter nekrub2
- Start date
birdman
Moderator
What's wrong with using a PowerTimer?
abu baniaz
Moderator
How do you use a power timer to activate a channel without switching on the display on the receiver?
adm
Forum Supporter
One thing I noticed when playing around with them today is that I can set 2 (or more) Zap timers for exactly the same time to change channels/programmes without a conflict warning appearing. Which zap timer will be used to change channels? The first one in the list? OR will the box attempt to change to more than one channel/programme.
(I deleted the conflicting zap timers before they activated so I don't know the answer to the above questions)
abu baniaz
Moderator
@ADM's finding prove that there is an error in the current functionality. There needs to be some conflict awareness.
My understanding is that a zap timer should have a start and an end. User can end it at will without being locked into that zap.
If TV was awake and on another service, it should zap back at end.
If it was in deep or regular standby, it should return to standby unless interrupted by zapping onto another service or a recording kicking in.
My understanding is that a zap timer should have a start and an end. User can end it at will without being locked into that zap.
If TV was awake and on another service, it should zap back at end.
If it was in deep or regular standby, it should return to standby unless interrupted by zapping onto another service or a recording kicking in.
How about a compromise, if possible?
ie an option to either just zap (and forget about it - ie open ended - do nothing else after this specific zap event) or zap for a specific time period (user defined)?
This would surely resolve both angles? Either way, as ADM has mentioned, a timer conflict check should be done to avoid potential timer conflict!
ie an option to either just zap (and forget about it - ie open ended - do nothing else after this specific zap event) or zap for a specific time period (user defined)?
This would surely resolve both angles? Either way, as ADM has mentioned, a timer conflict check should be done to avoid potential timer conflict!
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abu baniaz
Moderator
For a conflict check to be conducted, both start and end times must exist. In the absence of both, that tuner will be unavailable indefinitely for validation purposes.
adm
Forum Supporter
I can see that being annoying especially as broadcasters break up films and other programmes with additional C*** five minute “celebrity” programmes. A zap timer with an end time may only see the half way point in a film as the end. I watch the start of a film, go out to make a cup of tea during the 5 minute interval break and while I'm out of the room the box changes channel again. I'm now watching, say, the adverts on this changed channel without realising that the second half of the film has started. I cannot even rewind because the act of changing channels has cleared the timeshift buffer.
I would prefer that a zap timer only changes channels once.
The point is to watch the programme so it can wake up from standby/deep standby and then the user can switch his box back to standby/deep standby after he has finished watching the live broadcast. Alternatively do as I have and set up a power timer to set the box to standby/deep standby after a user defined period of remote control inactivity.
abu baniaz
Moderator
Or....
Set a start up service. When box wakes up, it will go to that service.
You cannot compare/rationalise an infinite item with a finite one. This is what needs to be done for clash detection.
Methodology/logic must be agreed before coding changes.
Set a start up service. When box wakes up, it will go to that service.
You cannot compare/rationalise an infinite item with a finite one. This is what needs to be done for clash detection.
Methodology/logic must be agreed before coding changes.
adm
Forum Supporter
If you already have the maximum number of possible record timers set-up and then you set a zap timer (currently without an end time) it does detect a conflict. This tells you that you cannot zap to that channel because all tuners will be used for other purposes at that (start) time.
Similarly if you have a zap timer set and then try and set record timers requiring more than the available tuners (the zap timer already having reserved one tuner) you also get a conflict warning indicating that you cannot record because a zap timer will attempt to change channels during that recording. (this will need further confirmation as i can see various different setting senarios)
What you may not get without a zap end time is a conflict warning if you set a record timer, say, to start 10 minutes after the zap timer is set to change channels.
I'm not sure that there is an ideal solution to how a zap timer should work and different people may have valid different ideas based on how they use there box on a day to day basis.
The conflict check doesn't seem to work when setting two zap timers for the same time.
Hi Bbbuk,
Regards,
Ian.
Except for the selection of a service this is exactly what a "Wakeup" "Power" timer does. This is why I am suggesting that "Zap" type timers may be appropriately moved to the "Power" timer area.
Regards,
Ian.
Hi Birdman,
Regards,
Ian.
I have used them in the past and they are now broken in that they don't hold the tuner and they don't properly appear in the EPG.
Regards,
Ian.
birdman
Moderator
Set a Power timer for time x and a Zap timer for time x+1.
birdman
Moderator
If you have two tuners (or the two channels can be recorded from one at the same time) then the current conflict code will pass such a situation as OK.
But they do not. Look at the menu that sets them - there is no option to set a time extent.
The current code is based on the assumption that there is a user sitting in front of it and all that they wish to do is to ensure the channel switches as a start of a programme they wish to watch. So they don't miss the start.
You are all discussing a sort of timer which does not currently exist but, for some reason, keep assuming that it is what the Zap timer is.
birdman
Moderator
birdman
Moderator
Power timers are there to affect the power state of the box (On, Standby, DeepStandby).
A Zap timer is solely to change the active channel - nothing to do with Power.
Power timers don't have any conflict checks.
birdman
Moderator
What release of Vix was this on? Or (roughly) when?
EDIT:
This is the current code in Screens/TimerEntry.py (which explains my 3m01s, as I have a default margin of 3m).
Code:
# if the timer type is a Zap and no end is set, set duration to 1 second so time is shown in EPG's.
if self.timerentry_justplay.value == "zap":
if not self.timerentry_showendtime.value:
end = begin + (config.recording.margin_before.value*60) + 1
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Hi Birdman,
Regards,
Ian.
As this would be considered a lesser priority timer than a "Record" or "Watch" timer the only conflict checking required would be to see, at the time of the timer firing, if there is a tuner free to display the service. If there is, use it. If not then the current service can't be selected. This is a simplistic conflict check and is all that should be required.
Regards,
Ian.
birdman
Moderator
Also, remember that you can set Zap timers to run in PiP.
(And, IIRC, some boxes can run multiple PiPs at the same time(?)).
So multiple overlapping Zap timers may be OK in some cases.
(And, IIRC, some boxes can run multiple PiPs at the same time(?)).
So multiple overlapping Zap timers may be OK in some cases.
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