Need help with new cable tuner - signal poor

[imish]

Bought a new cable tuner to add to the box - so now have two cable and 1 sat tuner in the box.

Having signal issues with some particular channels

With one tuner connected - BBC 2 - 86%
With both tuners connected - drops to 76% and pixelates

Same with BBC news and with channel 5

Other channels like BBC 1 and itv are unaffected

So seems like losing signal strength with both tuners connected - what can I do to amplify the signal?








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[adm]

Bought a new cable tuner to add to the box - so now have two cable and 1 sat tuner in the box.

Having signal issues with some particular channels

With one tuner connected - BBC 2 - 86%
With both tuners connected - drops to 76% and pixelates

Same with BBC news and with channel 5

Other channels like BBC 1 and itv are unaffected

So seems like losing signal strength with both tuners connected - what can I do to amplify the signal?

How are you connecting the tuners?

A single cable from a (3 way) splitter to each tuner input?

OR

Tuner 1 input comes from a splitter and then Tuner 1 output connected to Tuner 2 input?

[imish]

Tried both

With the former - signals levels of both tuners are the same and hence they pixelate on the Same channels

With the latter - the tuner connected directly works fine and the "looped" one pixelates on those specific channels.

[adm]

Tried both

With the former - signals levels of both tuners are the same and hence they pixelate on the Same channels

With the latter - the tuner connected directly works fine and the "looped" one pixelated on this specific channels.

Have you tried with a 2 way splitter and tuner 1 output looped through to tuner 2 input.

A two way splitter has a lower signal loss compared with a three way splitter. Using a three way splitter with one unused output is not a good idea as you can get impedance mismatches and signal reflections which can degrade the signal.

Another possibility is local electrical interference getting in through poorly screened fly leads. If electrical local interference is suspected try, as a test, turning off all nearby electrical items except your box and the TV. Plug in wall wart power supplies can cause a lot of electrical interference at specific frequencies

[imish]

I should have mentioned that I have a two way splitter and not a 3 way.

interesting point about interference - will give that a try tomorrow and see if it makes a difference.

any other splitters on the market that can amplify the signal?

[DaMacFunkin]

Yes, cheap chinese ones on ebay are fine BUT, you may need to use the provided connectors with some of them, it is important you fit these properly and don't introduce noise or interference.
50645
This looks like it has normal RF connectors which would be better, but still beware fitting any plugs yourself, any noise IN, would be amplified OUT.
Cable is really sensitive to Noise and faulty plug fittings, much more so than normal Ariel.
p.s. make sure you use a 3 amp fused UK adaptor.
p.p.s. make sure you buy a 220v one!!!

[adm]

interesting point about interference - will give that a try tomorrow and see if it makes a difference.


Often cured by using WF100/CT100 type fly-leads which have 100% copper screening.



any other splitters on the market that can amplify the signal?

You could insert an aerial amp/booster in line AFTER the passive splitter and before the tuner input. You don't want your broadband signals going through the amp/booster.

Random Example


https://www.amazon.co.uk/SLx-27822HSG-Output-Booster-Compatible/dp/B00DB22ZUC/ref=dp_ob_title_ce

This amp has variable gain. You can also have too much signal!

Often recommended as one of the better quality products on one of the other forums I subscribe to is the PROception range of amplifiers from Blakes Aerials, but at a higher cost


https://www.amazon.co.uk/PROception-Professional-digital-Amplifier-Booster/dp/B002GT7TBQ/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1475393349&sr=1-1&keywords=proception+2way

Note: the PROception has a low fixed gain so without knowing what signal strength may cure your problem a variable gain device may be the better bet

There are many more of this type of amp/booster available on-line or from your local Argos/Maplin/Tesco etc.

[imish]

Using these patch leads
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/191062441018?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Thanks - will look into boosters with variable gain.

Any thoughts on these?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Satellite-Signal-Amplifier-Booster-electrosmart®/dp/B003S5LBVQ/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1475397177&sr=1-2&keywords=Twin+Output+Signal+Booster+variable+gain

[imish]

found a few more on eBay - need a 2 way splitter
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_odkw=Cable+CATV+TV+VCR+Signal+Booster+Ampl ifier+AMP+Splitter+Converter+220V&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.XCable+CAT V+Signal+Booster+Amplifier+AMP+Splitter+Converter+ 220V.TRS0&_nkw=Cable+CATV+Signal+Booster+Amplifier+AMP+Split ter+Converter+220V&_sacat=0

[adm]

Using these patch leads
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/191062441018?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

They are OK RG6 suitable TV via an aerial or cable. They will be fully screened.



Any thoughts on these?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Satellite-Signal-Amplifier-Booster-electrosmart®/dp/B003S5LBVQ/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1475397177&sr=1-2&keywords=Twin+Output+Signal+Booster+variable+gain

Ideally you need 1 input and 2 outputs.

If you are worried about different connector types then you can get screw on F to coax adapters with a choice of male or female ends and/or male female F ends.
The sponsor sells them or variety of sellers have packs of 4/8 etc on a well known auction site
http://www.world-of-satellite.co.uk/satellite-and-terrestrial/connectors-and-adaptors



http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/F-Socket-Adaptor-to-Male-Female-Coax-Adaptors-F-plug-/351052073150?hash=item51bc5588be:g:~hQAAMXQ4YtSL1W t

[adm]

found a few more on eBay - need a 2 way splitter
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_odkw=Cable+CATV+TV+VCR+Signal+Booster+Ampl ifier+AMP+Splitter+Converter+220V&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.XCable+CAT V+Signal+Booster+Amplifier+AMP+Splitter+Converter+ 220V.TRS0&_nkw=Cable+CATV+Signal+Booster+Amplifier+AMP+Split ter+Converter+220V&_sacat=0


My last order from a Ebay Chinese seller took 5+ weeks to be delivered. This seller estimates delivery between 18 Oct and 9 Nov. In my experience the latter date may be optimistic.

[imish]

They are OK RG6 suitable TV via an aerial or cable. They will be fully screened.



Ideally you need 1 input and 2 outputs.

If you are worried about different connector types then you can get screw on F to coax adapters with a choice of male or female ends and/or male female F ends.
The sponsor sells them or variety of sellers have packs of 4/8 etc on a well known auction site
http://www.world-of-satellite.co.uk/satellite-and-terrestrial/connectors-and-adaptors



http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/F-Socket-Adaptor-to-Male-Female-Coax-Adaptors-F-plug-/351052073150?hash=item51bc5588be:g:~hQAAMXQ4YtSL1W t


So these patch leads are good enough?

Funnily enough the channels are working fine today and I haven't done anything.

Maybe the cable provider were messing with the network yesterday.....




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[adm]

So these patch leads are good enough?

Your patch/fly leads are more than adequate for your application. RG6 cable is rated for terrestrial and cable frequencies and is fully screened. I note that your leads are terminated in F connectors so are you using an screw on F to coax adapter at the end that plugs into the tuner?



Funnily enough the channels are working fine today and I haven't done anything.


Or you are just on that signal level area between reliable and unreliable and a low gain amplifier/booster may be suitable.

[imish]

Your patch/fly leads are more than adequate for your application. RG6 cable is rated for terrestrial and cable frequencies and is fully screened. I note that your leads are terminated in F connectors so are you using an screw on F to coax adapter at the end that plugs into the tuner?



Or you are just on that signal level area between reliable and unreliable and a low gain amplifier/booster may be suitable.

yes - a mix of male and female coax/f adaptors to terminate the cables appropriately.

think you are right about the signal strength - been a learning experience :)

I've reverted back to a single cable connected to the main feed and the 2nd loop through - that way atleast I get perfect reception on one tuner until I get a suitable amplifier - maybe for the 2nd feed - any thoughts on something like this? - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mix-Digital-Inline-Satellite-Amplifier-20db-SAT-AMP-Signal-Booster-/331755064957?hash=item4d3e248e7d:g:SXMAAOSwi0RXyEG m

[DaMacFunkin]

Often cured by using WF100/CT100 type fly-leads which have 100% copper screening.



You could insert an aerial amp/booster in line AFTER the passive splitter and before the tuner input. You don't want your broadband signals going through the amp/booster.

Random Example


https://www.amazon.co.uk/SLx-27822HSG-Output-Booster-Compatible/dp/B00DB22ZUC/ref=dp_ob_title_ce

This amp has variable gain. You can also have too much signal!

Often recommended as one of the better quality products on one of the other forums I subscribe to is the PROception range of amplifiers from Blakes Aerials, but at a higher cost


https://www.amazon.co.uk/PROception-Professional-digital-Amplifier-Booster/dp/B002GT7TBQ/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1475393349&sr=1-1&keywords=proception+2way

Note: the PROception has a low fixed gain so without knowing what signal strength may cure your problem a variable gain device may be the better bet

There are many more of this type of amp/booster available on-line or from your local Argos/Maplin/Tesco etc.
The guy is having problems with his cable channels, normal ariel boosters shouldn't be able to operate in the same frequency range should they?

[DaMacFunkin]

yes - a mix of male and female coax/f adaptors to terminate the cables appropriately.

think you are right about the signal strength - been a learning experience :)

I've reverted back to a single cable connected to the main feed and the 2nd loop through - that way atleast I get perfect reception on one tuner until I get a suitable amplifier - maybe for the 2nd feed - any thoughts on something like this? - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mix-Digital-Inline-Satellite-Amplifier-20db-SAT-AMP-Signal-Booster-/331755064957?hash=item4d3e248e7d:g:SXMAAOSwi0RXyEG m

That booster is for satellite, it draws power from the set top box lnb feed, on cable the power comes the other way from the green box so it might not work.

[adm]

yes - a mix of male and female coax/f adaptors to terminate the cables appropriately.

think you are right about the signal strength - been a learning experience :)

I've reverted back to a single cable connected to the main feed and the 2nd loop through - that way atleast I get perfect reception on one tuner until I get a suitable amplifier - maybe for the 2nd feed


As I've posted before, 1 input and 2 outputs and fit the amp/booster after the passive splitter and then a lead from each of the amp/booster outputs to each of the tuner inputs. This way you can isolate each tuner.

Consider:
i) Both tuners are exactly the same and if one is marginal on signal strength the other will also be marginal, hence both need an increase in signal level
ii) If tuner 1 output is causing problem with noise all you will be doing by placing an amp between tuner 1 and tuner 2 is an amplification of the noise.


- any thoughts on something like this? - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mix-Digital-Inline-Satellite-Amplifier-20db-SAT-AMP-Signal-Booster-/331755064957?hash=item4d3e248e7d:g:SXMAAOSwi0RXyEG m

In my opinion amplifying frequencies up to 2400 MHz may just introduce more noise into the system. An Amp/booster up to 1000Mhz (UHF) is more suited for amplifying terrestrial/cable signals.
Note: I'm not sure of the highest frequency used by Virgin but be aware that for terrestrial TV via an aerial the frequency range has been reduced to 700MHz and some of the UHF amp/boosters now incorporate a 4G (mobile phone) filter to exclude frequencies above 700MHz.

The gain of the amp you link to is 20db which will amplify your signal level by x10. I suspect that a gain of x1.5 (4dB) to x2 (6dB) is more than adequate as you say that your system appears to be is just on the point of being unreliable. A 20dB (x10) gain is likely to completely overload (in a non destructive way) the front end of your tuners and you will end up with no channels being detected.

Have you got the 5V output turned on? menu -> set-up -> sevice searching -> tuner configuration -> select each of you cable tuners and check for 'Enable 5V for active antenna' = off. If this is currently switched to on it may be the source of your problem.

[imish]

Interesting post - lots to take in.

Haven't seen the 5V setting - will check that again

Btw: I've just ordered this - now after reading your post not sure whether this will work with cable..

Monacor 400MHz SAT F Attenuator https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B004APIYNQ/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_Piw8xb4XH69JJ



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[imish]

To be clear what sort of specs am I looking for in an inline amplifier / booster?

Based on the thread so far it seems

upto 1000mhz
75ohm
Upto 6gb gain or adjustable


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[adm]

A bit more research says cable is 5 or 47MHz to 860MHz albeit carrying some legacy services. Therefore, as pointed out by another poster, an aerial amp will not be suitable as many modern aerial boosters now filter out the recent and future mobile phone frequency allocation which is anything above 700MHz and the emergency services (legacy) Tetra frequencies.



http://www.aerialsandtv.com/appendix.html#CableTVfrequencies


so
5 to 860MHz (or maybe 48 to 860) - you may only find them 5 to 2400Mhz but if the higher figure is towards 860 to 1000MHz the better, The above link also links to a 2 way 47 to 860 amp
75 Ohms
Probably 6db to 10dB or variable
1 input , 2 outputs or more outputs.

[cactikid]

what are others stating their signal levels are with that box as i have et 10000 and level is around 53 for both and perfect viewing,tratec splitter 5-1000mhz on a cable that has another splitter on.

question is correct net id in use and excellent cable and splitters in use?


was wondering on all those ebay items from china like a certain z***** box ?

[DaMacFunkin]

To be clear what sort of specs am I looking for in an inline amplifier / booster?

Based on the thread so far it seems

upto 1000mhz
75ohm
Upto 6gb gain or adjustable


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Just get the box i posted in the pic off ebay, i have used two or three for people and they worked fine and cost less than a tenner, just be sure to fit any plugs correctly to minimise noise.

[DaMacFunkin]

Have you got the 5V output turned on? menu -> set-up -> sevice searching -> tuner configuration -> select each of you cable tuners and check for 'Enable 5V for active antenna' = off. If this is currently switched to on it may be the source of your problem.

You don't get that option when the tuner is switched to cable, as stated before about satellite, the box can send power to the lnb or ariel, but with cable the power comes from the green box.
Just because the tuner can be switched between cable and ariel doesn't mean they work the same.

[imish]

Just get the box i posted in the pic off ebay, i have used two or three for people and they worked fine and cost less than a tenner, just be sure to fit any plugs correctly to minimise noise.

ordered - will take a month to arrive from the far east......lets hope it isn't an empty metal box