Can a Fransat CI+ Cam work in a Vu+ box?

[sandiego69]

I want to watch either Fransat from 5W or TNT from 19E by using perhaps a CI+ Cam and card that are available.

My worry is that I have read somewhere that the CI+ Cam does not work in a box such as the Duo2. It may not be the box itself but a problem with the Enigma software.
I have also read of a number of possible solutions such as using just a card and either CCCam, Oscam or Scam.

In other words I am totally confused as to the best solution. I do not have a built in satellite module in my TV so I am restricted in using my Duo2.

I am going to France in a few months but again I don't know what to look out for.

Any help here would be great.

[Rob van der Does]

I've heard (meaning: I'm absolutely not sure) that TNTSat cards are 'married' to the box with which they are being sold, and that FranSat cards can be used in a softcam.
CI+ is currently not supported by ViX, although several other teams do provide this support.
Are you aware that a number of French services are FTA on 5W? Together with some 19.2 FTA services, you can have a reasonable French FTA-package.

[sandiego69]

Rob

Are you saying that with either a Fransat or TNT card and a softcam ?? I can see all the channels on offer.

[Rob van der Does]

Are you saying that with either a Fransat or TNT card and a softcam ??
No.
1- As far as I know (heard) TNTSat can't be on any E2 box any more.
2- As far as I know (heard) a Fransat-card can (still) be used in the cardreader of an E2-box, using a softcam.
3- Quite a lot of services are FTA (on 5W + 19.2E) so no card is required for them at all.

[sandiego69]

OK, lets take option 2. I would be prepared to go with Fransat even though I know TNTSat has more channels. If I could press you further, which softcam would be the best to use for Fransat?

Doing a quick check I found most of the channels are actually scrambled but this was a very hurried survey so cannot be taken as the norm.

[Rob van der Does]

I would always advise Oscam.
But again: I can't guarantee you that the Franssat card will work.

You can also buy a dedicated Fransat receiver (around €100, also available at sponsor) and see if the card works in an E2-box. If not, you can use that receiver.
Or search the internet about E2-compatibility.

[pmatil]

CI+ is currently not supported by ViX, although several other teams do provide this support.

Sorry to barge in the thread but how do you mean CI+ is not supported? I'm using CI+ module and card on my Duo 2 with OpenVIX and it works just fine (requires pairing by the service provider of course). The module is a Smit one (cable/terrestrial DVB).

[sandiego69]

The fact that CI+ is not supported in VIX I thought was well documented. ( See Robs post above as one example.)
I would be interested to know what exactly you are using the CI+ Cam for, for example, which card, which channels etc.

I have been told I cannot use a CI+ Cam and card with either a Fransat or TNTSat sytem.

[Rob van der Does]

Sorry to barge in the thread but how do you mean CI+ is not supported? I'm using CI+ module and card on my Duo 2 with OpenVIX and it works just fine (requires pairing by the service provider of course). The module is a Smit one (cable/terrestrial DVB).
Then you are lucky: apparently the '+' part (which for the user is actually a big minus :) ) hasn't (yet) been activated by your provider. In other words: it's acting like a normal CAM, not like a CI+_module.

BTW: this seems to be the normal way of introducing CI+ by providers; so people get used to using a CI+_module, unaware of the Trojan Horse they got into their homes. And after some time the '+' part will be activated (in small steps) with the result that in the end only the provider can decide what can be recorded, how many times it may be watched, after what period it gets losts, that no fast-forward is allowed during their intrusive advertising and more.

[pmatil]

So I can have a paired module and card without it using the CI+ actually even though it's paired? This I didn't know. And it didn't work at all without pairing. The card is a LA Digital Smit Conax Cable HD Ready / Antenna HD Ready. It's a local Brand but I believe it's very close to this module: http://www.smit.com.cn/public/website/eng/product_cam_consumer_display.php?id=10

It has been reported by our local VU+ distributor that this card is the only one that works with Enigma boxes.

[sandiego69]

I see you probably have a Conax Cam but you still have not said what channels/provider you are decrypting.

[Rob van der Does]

So I can have a paired module and card without it using the CI+ actually even though it's paired?
Be careful with those statements, as they are not general.
Apparently it works for this specific combination, but that doesn't say anything about other cards/modules.

[tappari]

So I can have a paired module and card without it using the CI+ actually even though it's paired? This I didn't know. And it didn't work at all without pairing. The card is a LA Digital Smit Conax Cable HD Ready / Antenna HD Ready. It's a local Brand but I believe it's very close to this module: http://www.smit.com.cn/public/website/eng/product_cam_consumer_display.php?id=10

It has been reported by our local VU+ distributor that this card is the only one that works with Enigma boxes.
Not true. In my boxes paired LA Digital works, but as well paired Dilog adapter. But as Rob mentioned, be careful. This is not general knowledge.
Those work in Finland with OpenViX, but other envinronments might be different.

[Rob van der Does]

Not true. In my boxes paired LA Digital works, but as well paired Dilog adapter. But as Rob mentioned, be careful. This is not general knowledge.
Those work in Finland with OpenViX, but other envinronments might be different.
And that even might be temporarily...

[tappari]

And that even might be temporarily...
Could be, but works at the moment. The problem with Enigma2 and CI+ modules at the moment is, that when recording Enigma2 doesn`t save recordings encrypted, but as unencrypted. So this is why you can only record one program at the time with these existing CI+ adapters.

[Rob van der Does]

Well, that's a more generic issue: those modules only allow to decode one stream at a time.
Several STB's, like Xtrends, are capable of recording coded streams in the coded format, and to decode them on playback. Unfortunately VU doesn't support that.

[tappari]

Well, that's a more generic issue: those modules only allow to decode one stream at a time.
Several STB's, like Xtrends, are capable of recording coded streams in the coded format, and to decode them on playback. Unfortunately VU doesn't support that.
Just a minute. How can my ET10000 do that and with which image?

[Rob van der Does]

Yes, using ViX, PLi and many others.
In the timer just set 'recording type' to 'don't decode, record ECM'. Now the recording will be scrambled, and descrambled on playback.

Be aware: the card-key must still be valid. Your provider decides how often the key will be changed; that can be 4-weekly, or even daily.

On a similar basis streams can be coded, including ECM. See 'customize' for the settings involved. Of course this requires the client box to have a valid card to be able to decode.


PS: I have never actually tested this before, but many told me that it works.

[sandiego69]

We seem to have strayed a little from the main subject here. I would really like to hear from anyone with personal experience of either Fransat or TNTSat.

[pmatil]

Could be, but works at the moment. The problem with Enigma2 and CI+ modules at the moment is, that when recording Enigma2 doesn`t save recordings encrypted, but as unencrypted. So this is why you can only record one program at the time with these existing CI+ adapters.

So even if setting the recording parameters to "don't decode" you can't record more than one channel at the time with VU+ Duo 2 box?

[tappari]

Yes, using ViX, PLi and many others.
In the timer just set 'recording type' to 'don't decode, record ECM'. Now the recording will be scrambled, and descrambled on playback.

Be aware: the card-key must still be valid. Your provider decides how often the key will be changed; that can be 4-weekly, or even daily.

On a similar basis streams can be coded, including ECM. See 'customize' for the settings involved. Of course this requires the client box to have a valid card to be able to decode.


PS: I have never actually tested this before, but many told me that it works.
I have tested this with my ET10000. It seems that recording is not scrambled with your settings, but box cannot descramble the recordings during playback even if card is installed to CI+ pared module.
Somehow it`s strange that there is possibility in Recording and playback settings to set Default recording type = don`t descramble, record ecm.
That actually does nothing.
So, how to do unscrambleded recordings with Enigma2 and ViX and still playback those?

[Rob van der Does]

In the mean time I've tested this.
I made not-descrambled recording with VU-DUO2 and Xtrend ET8000; those were not readable with the VU (as expected, cause VU simply doesn't support this), but were fine for the 8k. I used the internal cardreader, as I have no CI(+) module to test.

[Rob van der Does]

See

http://wiki.openpli.org/comparison
under 'delayed decoding' for all PLi-supported boxes that support this function.