VU+ Duo Channel search question

[Conaxthewarrior]

Hello all,
When a search is started, does the VU+Duo find new updated transponders & frequencies as it searches or does it re-read from the existng data stored such that new data has to be loaded in manually?
I ask because I matched the frequencies as they appeared against those listed on the net and it was very accurate but I cant remember putting any new data in!!!
Thanks
Conaxthewarrior

[leecovuk]

I might be wrong (anybody who knows better please correct me) but I think it works like this :

An 'automatic' scan is the same as a 'manual' 'multisat' scan with 'network scan' set to 'yes'.
ie the receiver will try to read the NIT data from any transponders it currently has that transmit NIT data. This should find and scan any new transponders.

However I have no idea which transponders on which satellites transmit this data.

The 'network scan' on the VU+ Duo seems pretty good, but NIT cannot be fully trusted to result in a complete transponder list on any receiver. This is apparently because the transmitted data is sometimes wrong or incomplete.

A weakness of the VU+ Duo's scanning for me seems to be transponders with very low symbol rates are missed and cannot even be successfully scanned manually, so you might find you need to forget about those at the moment.

Lee
UK

[silverfox0786]

your easiest route wil be to get a satellite.xml file to the sats you want and place it in usr/tuxbox and then do a full automatic scan and all frequencies will update with what is current againt the satellite.xml file which is updated daily

i make a 28.2e bouquet and i can safly say that i have never lost a channel yet that has not scanned infact i found some i never knew about

[leecovuk]

i have never lost a channel yet that has not scanned infact i found some i never knew about
I don't want to drive this topic majorly off its focus, but do you find any problems with low symbol rate transponders? There are several on Hotbird, for example.

Thanks,
Lee

[silverfox0786]

i have not used hotbird in a while a few months infact but the last time i used it was on a non linux box and i was catching over a few thousand channels. i only used it FTA but all the channels i wanted i was getting with a good sygnal

[leecovuk]

Actually, having now looked quickly at Kingofsat, it seems Hotbird currently has no active examples.
Hispasat probably does.

Lee

[silverfox0786]

no i never had a prob with hispasat the only problem sat for me was nilesat but i even used to pick that after an hours worth of single pulse fine tuning

[leecovuk]

eg can anybody scan these on a VU+ Duo?

(Hispasat 30.0 West)

11640,H,1300,78,DVB-S,QPSK :

RADIO ECCA
PUNTO RADIO
RADIO EL DIA
7.7 RADIO
CAN.RAD

11651,V,1010,34,DVB-S,QPSK :

R-1_Prado
R-Clasica
R-3
R-5_Prado

[leecovuk]

Silverfox, did you / could you please try those Hispasat transponders?

Thanks,
Lee

[silverfox0786]

The moterised is at dads house mate so cant test till i go there at some point. but in the mean time if someone else can that would be good

[Ojustaboo]

your easiest route wil be to get a satellite.xml file to the sats you want and place it in usr/tuxbox and then do a full automatic scan and all frequencies will update with what is current againt the satellite.xml file which is updated daily

i make a 28.2e bouquet and i can safly say that i have never lost a channel yet that has not scanned infact i found some i never knew about

and to quote another thread


silverfox;

I have just uploaded and sent your setings to my box and nat geo +1hr, and nat geo still does not work


ahhhhh now i know what your issue is

have you downloaded a new satellites.xml latest and then done a full rescan to update the actual box itself so the bouquets can see the new frequesncies within the bouquet

place satellites.xml in usr/tuxbox do a full scan and it will show up

I flashed my box and simply ftpd the settings file I wanted to it using dreamboxedit.

Then every time a channel disappears, I find out the new info and manually enter it into dreamboxedit and re-ftp.

Are you saying that I'm doing it wrong and that I should still be scanning and if I do so, it will find the changes automatically or am I completely misunderstanding you?

Many thanks

[silverfox0786]

a new scan updates the lamedb and if the lamedb does not have that perticular frequency within the lamedb file then no matter what you do you have to rescan or the new ftp'ed channel will be greyed out

and the satellite xml is what determins what active frequencies are available

[Ojustaboo]

Thanks, I presume that as I've ftpd settings to the box, when I do a scan I set the "Clear before scan" to "no" ?

I'll know what I'm doing one day :)

[silverfox0786]

oj where all the same here theres loads i'm still learning and i wasn't aware of this scan thing untill it happened to me but the box does do a background scan too so most times it updates and its in the new bouquet. the only time it wont autoscan a new channel is if the frequency is not in the sat.xml and even then you can do a network/blind scan to over come that just takes longer to do

[Ojustaboo]

Thanks for a superb settings list, am now using that instead of my own one :)

One suggestion (or I'm doing something wrong as usual)

If I go into the epg (Vix and coolepg) and press 0 to go to the first channel, I get channel no 1 rather than 101.

As I have the mini TV displayed, I have to go down a page before I get to BBC2 etc.

To get around this, I created a bouquet called "Unused", placed it above "SKY UK® 28.2°E Silverfox0786" and then moved the 100 entries before chanel 101 into this Bouquet.

Now, when I'm on your Bouquet, pressing 0 in the epg takes me to 101.

Thanks for a great list.

[silverfox0786]

i set channel position 1 as 101 it the panic button and its reaction is just as you described and what its ment to do

although i see you have come to a solution for this

and i will say pretty neat idea

[Conaxthewarrior]

Nilesat is the only sat I have problems with. Total absence of channels (excepting some few tp far west sats). i put it down to all beams focused to the middle east, but if silver, you can recieve some, than I'm clearly wrong. So what should I do to recieve, aprt from taking more time searching & not relying on autosearch!!!)

[silverfox0786]

Nilesat is the only sat I have problems with. Total absence of channels (excepting some few tp far west sats). i put it down to all beams focused to the middle east, but if silver, you can recieve some, than I'm clearly wrong. So what should I do to recieve, aprt from taking more time searching & not relying on autosearch!!!)

you just need to sit there for hours mate pulsing it one at a time

but with that said this i got on a actuator and the ad3600 ipva

[leecovuk]

I only have 4 satellites but my obsession with trying to keep the channel list fully updated and customised tends to drive me round in circles. I don't like to trust automatic or network scanning to find everything available, plus I have 'special requirements'. They are, I force the channel names to be all upper case and also add the satellite name at the end of each channel name. I achieve this with a mixture of Dreamboxedit, Dreamset, and Open Office Calc.

I tend to come unstuck somewhere regarding satellites.xml and manage to screw up my super efforts at a final stage! I think HD channels and possibly the rolloff parameter may be involved in my problems.
Either the satellites.xml I download from satellites-xml.eu isn't quite the same as the VU+ Duo's (unlikely), or I am updating / clearing it wrongly in Dreamboxedit. (more likely)

I get there eventually but I haven't yet done so confidently.
Maybe I am falling foul of lamedb V satellites.xml differences which silverfox mentioned a few posts above.

I wouldn't recommend my habits or methods ... unless you are a masochist.

Lee

[silverfox0786]

you got a simple problem lee that can be fixed [dont ask why i'm still awake]

first send your customised bouquet to your vu the one you say you have customised to your perfection once thats in that will stay no matter what unless you delete it or change it.

then get you sat.xml [if you want give me the sat you want and i will generate it for you and post it here]

once that is done do a rescan of all the satellites with the setting clear before scan enabled

once the complete scan is done all available channels will be in the box [at this point dont worry about where they are or what order]

now this is crunch time. As long as you have a good signal streanth all channels available will have been scanned [again not worried where they are as long as they are scanned]

now those bouquets that you made and sent to the box they come into play.

A scan will not delete or move them they will still be there in the same order as you put them there

now what happens here in essenceis the channels that where scanned and placed where you dont know will be arranged and placed according to the bouquets

The only thing that you must look at is the channel frequencies. in other words did your created bouquets have the corresponding frequencies that where in the sat.xml for which the lamedb was created.

to break that down further if your bouquet has e.g. freq 11584 then does the sat,xml have that too and then the sid say 47589 is that in the lamedb
in otherwords freq: 11584 sid 47589 which is in your bouquet is that valid and if it is it will be in the lamedb if its not vailid it wont be and will be greyed out. simply because it does not exist and was not created into lamedb.

if i have lost you then i'm a rubish teacher and there is no hope for my teaching carear. and the best thing to do is give me your bouquet and i'll see what i can do for you

[leecovuk]

Thanks for that, Silverfox, I do appreciate it.

I think I understand and think I am finally performing the sequence using the same logic you've described.

A key problem seems to have indeed been unwittingly deleting transponders for channels I previously had in bouquets which were of slightly different transponder details than that of the new downloaded satellites.xml
ie towards the end of my 'process' I was noticing most or all transponders were duplicated and then my 'clearing' of satellites.xml in Dreamboxedit is where I think I have been coming unstuck.

So, the key thing here seems to be understanding the relationship between the bouquets, lamedb and satellites.xml

I'm still feeling my way around this and thinking more about the sequence in which I am doing everything. If anybody else reading this wants to manually fiddle with their lists, think and check carefully at each step and make sure you keep a backup of what you had to start with in case it all goes t*ts up!

By the way, to retain my channel names customisation in the receiver, I am using Dreamset to force 'untouched by SDT' on them. I don't know how that differs to 'locked'. I think I am trying to mimic 'disable background scanning' which the PLi images have.

Lee

[Conaxthewarrior]

Is there a latest sat.xml for all satellites available? Mine is from october 2010.

[Conaxthewarrior]

I did, no signal at all (from jutland peninsular denmark)

[zola25]

Hi conaxthewarrior
are you another Brit living in Denmark? i also live in jutland near vejle
Sorry its off topic

[leecovuk]

Is there a latest sat.xml for all satellites available? Mine is from october 2010.
Go to satellites-xml.eu and download one there.
As far as I know they are up to date.

[Larry-G]

satellites-xml.eu update their transponder lists several times a day so any time you generate a satellites.xml file it is the most upto date it can be. for proof it tells you when the DB was last updated at the bottom of site.

Currently in database: 155 positions / 6369 transponders
Last update: 11,672 MHz @ Astra 3A/3B 23.5E / 14.12.2010 @ 23:01 [GMT]

[leecovuk]

satellites-xml.eu update their transponder lists several times a day so any time you generate a satellites.xml file it is the most upto date it can be. for proof it tells you when the DB was last updated at the bottom of site.
Thanks,
What I really meant is 'I assume they are accurate' but I haven't found a reason to doubt them yet.

[Larry-G]

Thanks,
What I really meant is 'I assume they are accurate' but I haven't found a reason to doubt them yet.

there as accurate as any other method of obtaining the data. they rely on people to scan the satellite in question and submit the necessary changes.
the only way you are going to guarantee absolute accuracy is if you purchase a satellite for it's blind scan abilities and run a new scan 4 to 5 times per day per satellite.

[Conaxthewarrior]

Yes indeed zola 25!! In Vejle, best for further info mail me at

[sorry mate read the rules #11]

[jd58]

Will adding a bouquet such as the Bm override the latest scan data - I lost all updated channels when I downloaded the BM Bouquet channel list which replaces exisitng channels which are no longer active. I tried the other way around - downloaded the BM bouquet first and then an automatic scan but only pick up half the channels. Is the BM bouquet that is downloaded to the VU the latest up to date with current transponder data?

[Conaxthewarrior]

Opps! Apologies.

[Conaxthewarrior]

I sucessfully downloaded a satellites xml file and up loaded it to my vu+ then found that there are some transponders missing eg on the 28 e satellite (for one, that repeating freesat info music). I'd guess there's more missing transponders over the 33E to 30W satelites I can recieve. Does anyone know if missing transponders are common in these satellite xml files?

[jusaju]

Hi
They are normal people who are doing these.Also channel lists.And channels are changing all the time in different packages.

..so maybe there can be mistakes :)