Your SNR & AGC on your VU+DUO, what do you get ?

[BRAVEHEART]

ok, on my VU+DUO over the weekend I had terrible problems with all my pay channels signal quality and strength (snr & agc), but especially the snr level, BUT, for some weird reason tonight everything is looking a heck of a lot better and I am totally lost for an answer to why or what happened, maybe someone else will know though if you care to comment please ? (p.s, there has been no windy weather, not even a breeze for days, so as I say, it defo has nothing to do with the dish, and the dish was only reset after the storms about a month ago too, done by a proffesional, also fitted brand new LNB too).

All my FTA channels were perfect and strong, but the pay channels were either not even strong enough to give any picture at all or if there was a picture it would freeze up every few seconds or a minute or so, but as I say, the FTA channels were all perfect and strong, even my seperate freesat tuner was perfect too, so it was defo nothing to do with the dish for a fact.

Anyway, as an example right now (tuesday morning 28th feb 2012) on the VU+DUO box I have choosen some channels at random and will tell you the snr (quality) and agc (strength) levels for each one and I would really really appreciate it if some other people in the uk with a perfectly fixed dish and a VU+DUO could also tell me thier snr & agc levels for these channels just as refrence please.

BBC one HD - SNR 93% - AGC 93%
ITV 1 HD - SNR 93% - AGC 93%
CHANNEL 4 HD - SNR 96% - AGC 93%
SKY SPORTS 1 HD - SNR 74% - AGC 95%
SKY MOVIES PREMIER HD - SNR 73% - AGC 86%
SKY MOVIES DRAMA HD - SNR 72% - AGC 86%

Would I be correct in saying those readings now are very very good or are they average ???

Thats why I would really appreciate if anyone in the uk with a VU+DUO could also tell me thier readings for those channels please, eh ??? Thank you so much if you can spare a few seconds to do this :)

Those readings of mines you can see that I have just given you were nothing like that at the weekend past, as I said, the pay channels most of the time were so bad that a picture wouldnt even appear on the screen, but the FTA channels didnt really have any problems at all, although even the FTA channels look a bit stronger and better quality signals now too.

I am clueless to what happened :smash:, and then all of a sudden everything is looking a heck of a lot better, hmmmm ?

Anyone with any comments then please post up, and even better still could some people give me thier readings for those channels just for reference purposes.

Thanks again. ;)

p.s
at the weekend when there was a lot of problems the SNR on just about all pay channels was only reaching about 54%-60% and the AGC levels were lower than what they are now too, and as I said, picture freeze or no pictures at all.

[Rob van der Does]

As has been said in another thread: STB's are no (calibrated) meters. You can't compare the figures of one box with those of another.
They are only meant to be able to allign your dish; for that it does a good job.
And about the AGC: you shouldn't even be looking at those values, it's SNR that counts.

So: get your own SNR as high as possible on all satellites and you're fine. And never try to compare with others/other boxes, there's really no point in that.

BTW: Why are you using such an old image?

[BRAVEHEART]

As has been said in another thread: STB's are no (calibrated) meters. You can't compare the figures of one box with those of another.
They are only meant to be able to allign your dish; for that it does a good job.
And about the AGC: you shouldn't even be looking at those values, it's SNR that counts.

So: get your own SNR as high as possible on all satellites and you're fine. And never try to compare with others/other boxes, there's really no point in that.

BTW: Why are you using such an old image?

Only was wanting a rough guide mate to what other peoples readings are after the problems that I explained I had at the weekend, that was all, no big deal in just asking is there ??

And I do understand what you mean too mate :)

As far as the image goes, I was just always under the impression that if its not broke then dont try and fix it, and its always been fine before, but your right, maybe its time to update to the latest version of VIX :), dont quite know if it would have been that that was causing the weekend problems though, but I guess it still a good idea to update, thanks.

[Rob van der Does]

1) regarding the issues you mentioned on pay-channels: as FTA channels were apparently not affected, a local dish issue seems to be unlikely. But even so: comparing with others seems rather pointless;
2) for sure an old image is not causing the effect you described. But using such an old version means that you don't benefit from all the improvements that have been made available. Up to you of course.

[BRAVEHEART]

1) regarding the issues you mentioned on pay-channels: as FTA channels were apparently not affected, a local dish issue seems to be unlikely. But even so: comparing with others seems rather pointless;
2) for sure an old image is not causing the effect you described. But using such an old version means that you don't benefit from all the improvements that have been made available. Up to you of course.

cheers, going to flash the latest image now, could you confirm if these are the two files I need, flash the small size one first and then the larger sized one, yes ??? (see the files mentioned).

this small one "duo_cfe_3_0_usb.zip (117.8 KB)"

and then this larger one "ViX-2.3.204-vuduo_usb.zip (48.77 MB)"

Thank you.

[Rob van der Does]

Yes, correct. And if you make a settings backup first, all your settings can be re-installed during the first install wizard (plugins will have to be installed by yourself at a later stage).

[BRAVEHEART]

Yes, correct. And if you make a settings backup first, all your settings can be re-installed during the first install wizard (plugins will have to be installed by yourself at a later stage).

ok think that worked well enough for now, reinstalled my backup settings tooo and everything looks like it was before with my boquets etc, happy days, just need to get my channels working now, lol.

Anyway, just to make sure, where is it in the menu again i look to see what is the version of vix that is installed, i am 99% sure it is installed but just cant find the option that shows me, can someone tell me please ??

[Rob van der Does]

Menu --> Information --> About

[BRAVEHEART]

ok think that worked well enough for now, reinstalled my backup settings tooo and everything looks like it was before with my boquets etc, happy days, just need to get my channels working now, lol.

Anyway, just to make sure, where is it in the menu again i look to see what is the version of vix that is installed, i am 99% sure it is installed but just cant find the option that shows me, can someone tell me please ??

found it, its cool, took some time to find that option though but eventually i did, got version 2.3 build 204 installed :), great stuff, now just to work out how to do the rest and get everything working, at least my backup settings worked good, all boquets and channels as they were before, now just to get it fully working :)

[Huevos]

Braveheart, all the public service channels (BBC1/2/3/4, ITV1/2/3/4, C4, More4, E4, C5, Fiver, 5*, etc) are on the new satellite (Astra 1N). That satellite is miles stronger in the UK than anything else at 28E. Pay TV channels on the other hand are mainly on Astra 2A, 2B, and EB1. So if you are getting the PSBs but not the pay channels there is probably something wrong with your install, maybe an alignment problem.

[Donnie]

The reason for the improvement is a whole load of BBC channels moved to Astra 1N last Friday, ITV was a few days before so anything you get on 1N will be much stronger.

oops did not finish reading all the replies namely the one above mine :confused:

[BRAVEHEART]

yes but I see the point of the free channels being stronger for the reasons mentioned, but for the pay channels to be so poor of quality signal (or whatever it is) then that part I cant understand, I mean so poor of quality that the picture freezes up or simply doesnt even give a picture at all, I have said all this earlier in the thread anyways if you read back all the details are there.

Getting sick of this now, the Vu duo is getting closer n closer to the bin, lol (and I aint joking), as the same problem from the weekend has started to happen again tonight, all FTA channels strong as can be and pay channels very very poor, somethings not right and its not down to me, all my stuff is fine, my dish is obviously fine as all the FTA channels on the vu duo and on my freesat receiver are fine and strong and good quality, but soon as I go near the pay channels its very different, last night for some reason out of the blue the pay channels signal strength and quality increased dramatically, and then now tonight as we speak they have went bad again like they were last weekend there.

I dont know whats going on :(

[Maxwell]

It sounds like you have a problem with your installation even though you get the FTA channels ok - the encrypted channels signal also carries the encryption information, if the signal is not as good as it should be the encryption data will be corrupted and can give the symptoms you describe.
I would start by checking the cable and F connectors paying particular attention to possible water ingress at the dish end once you are sure this is ok I would be looking at dish alignment and LNB skew and if all is good look to replace the LNB, a noisy LNB especially if it has too much Phase noise will destroy encryption data and the receiver will not be able to acheive phase lock.
You cannot rely on a sat receiver signal strength meter you need a proper dedicated one to be accurate.
A sat receiver will display a combined amount of both signal and noise, because this reading is taken from the Tuner before filtering this means that it could show a signal strength of say 95% but 25% of that could be noise so your actual signal would be 70% so for instance you could fit a new LNB but the receiver signal strength actually goes down (less noise) but your channels a received just fine because of the cleaner signal.
You say you had a day where the encrypted channels came up good and then reverted back to being crap - this is an indicator that something is wrong with the dish end of things as its possible that the weather conditions were just right or wind nudging the dish

[Donnie]

I assume the pay channels you view you have the card for ?

With the SNR you list I can not see the signal being the problem, I can watch with a SNR of 50% with no issues.

[Maxwell]

I assume the pay channels you view you have the card for ?

With the SNR you list I can not see the signal being the problem, I can watch with a SNR of 50% with no issues.

Good point Donnie I was assuming a local card

[BRAVEHEART]

yes of course its all paid for :)

and if you read back you would see that i did say that the dish was reset just after the storms in the uk, when was that, maybe 3 weeks ago, theres not even been a breeze since, and it was professionally done too and also a brand new LNB installed and after that reset and LNB everything was perfect, and as far as the freesat receiver and the free to air channels on the vu duo they have been fine all through this (apart from when the dish was knocked out during the storms), but now just since the past weekend the pay channels have not been good at all like i keep saying, I dont think I need to repeat what I have already said over and over, maybe the other night they worked a lot better but then changed again last night, so theres something going on.

I will say yet again though, the FTA channels on the vu duo and on my freesat have been fine, so that rules out any problems with the dish or connecters or LNB etc, so like I say, I am still stumpped for an answer for this :(

I dont mean to sound negative to people and I appreciate every single bit of comments and advice etc, but its just annoying when I cant figure out what is happening, I am sure you must understand what I mean ?

thanks :)

p.s
donnie, if my snr drops below about 59% then I start to have problems and thats exactly the point I am getting at, maybe your in another part of the uk (england) that has better signal quality or summit, i dunno, but mines certainly breaks up if i get close to mid 50's, anything in the 60's or 70's is usually good though.

[Donnie]

I will say yet again though, the FTA channels on the vu duo and on my freesat have been fine, so that rules out any problems with the dish or connecters or LNB etc, so like I say, I am still stumpped for an answer for this


OK, I am not convinced the problem is a signal issue for the reason stated above.

Good part is the card is local so we can help a little.

Which emu are you using ? and are you allowing emms ? if yes how may and what sort ?

[BRAVEHEART]

sorry, i think it was my other thread i mentioned the dish had been reset and new lnb etc, my mistake, sorry about that, was just reading back there to check it, wooops, lol

@ donnie, I will hold my hands up and tell you I aint really got a clue what your on about when you start talking about emulators etc mate, no sense in kidding is there, I have someone do this all for me, all I know is the facts that I have stated, thats all mate unfortunatley :(

[Donnie]

All I can suggest is it's time for you to do your homework on it as I would put money on the fact that this is where your problem lies.

A log from the emu would be a good place to start.

[Foxylady]

Braveheart first of all i ain't no installer myself.
But from experience in having clone 800 2 year ago, man that thing drove me nuts i was thinking all sorts lol.
Anyway i have a duo, i have taken a video and i will put it up to show others to eliminate the questions as regard glitch issues, need to find it first thou haha, but will explain why i took it.
My signals on the motorised are about 60-70 tops at moment and have been since i decided to be brave and move my dish inorder to fit a new lnb.
i must must say to you fella, please please buy the black ultra lnb, they are f***ing quality.
My dish moved in past due to wind and have tighten the bolts up and it hasn't moved, then i wanted to try this lnb people were going on about, think mine was £13 delivered on ebay.
So now i totally screwed the signal on the dish after fitting new lnb as mine is approx 12ft on side of house and limited space due to wall separating mine and heighbours house so was tough, but getting someone out to pay again was annoying me, but had a friend come round slighty moving it about whilst i looked at the box and got the signals back to 60-70% signal on all sats.
I wanted to test how good this lnb was and i noticed that even on 60% i would get odd glitch as the olde well 1 year approx lnb would give me approx 60-65 agc i.e actual gain control, learnt that from google lol.
This black ultra agc is 90-99 on all sats and i never ever get one glitch even in the very windy days as i made sure the dish & pole are not gunna move lol.
Bear in mind i never tampered with a dish before, but doing the above gave me confidence to buy a 60cm mk4 sky dish and mount it near the motorised and now get 91-99 on signal and both dishes are at rear, house right next to them approx 10 foot gap so have the roof slight in way and i get bob on signals.
Defo get that lnb i mention fella first, then go up to teh dish and retighten the nuts.
Another tip as i work on older cars, hate new ones lol, is buy some ignition sealant in a spray can basically used for the coil, ht leads and dizzy cap to prevent moisture getting in and spray it over the connection where the plug connects to the lnb, this will stop any rain tampering wiht the signal.
Also spray your entire dish with laquer, this will as you know will stop water sitting on the dish and keep it rust free.
These are free tiem only, and very little money and kepe your gear in top nick for many years to come.
But your dish is moving and if a cheapo lnb which no doubt is from what is sold in kits the lnb will not be helping.
My pole for the motorised is not straight i.e plum by any means but i got the best signal i could on all sats and never any issues at all.
This is the lnb you need bud, trust me on this as i was lost also and took the plunge, but i only bought it to see what others were raving about and had to see why.
Signal increased and agc went up approx 20% and not once glitch in wind, rain ever since, think my little ideas help also lol

XXXXXX

Make sure your box is right as regards settings etc, if you need any live help pm me your live messenger addy and we'll chat there and i will give you as much help as possible.
Best wishes.

P.s going to look for that video i took to show you i think it was 29% signal and picture never once moved or froze etc

[Sicilian]

Sponsor has the Black Inverto LNB's http://www.world-of-satellite.com/showthread.php?16183-Cam-not-restarting&p=119798#post119798 You'd most likely need one of these too http://www.world-of-satellite.co.uk/LNB/Inverto-LNB/TRIAX-40mm-LNB-Holder-Kit-With-Adaptor-for-Elliptical-Zone-1-and-2-Dish

Or you could try a 63cm Zone 2 dish http://www.world-of-satellite.co.uk/Satallite-Dishes/Raven-Sky-Zone1-and-Zone2-dishes/Raven-Sky-Zone-2-63cm-Mesh-Dish-kit-with-QUAD-LNB-and-wall-mount complete with quad lnb and wall mount brackets.

[BRAVEHEART]

Braveheart first of all i ain't no installer myself.
But from experience in having clone 800 2 year ago, man that thing drove me nuts i was thinking all sorts lol.
Anyway i have a duo, i have taken a video and i will put it up to show others to eliminate the questions as regard glitch issues, need to find it first thou haha, but will explain why i took it.
My signals on the motorised are about 60-70 tops at moment and have been since i decided to be brave and move my dish inorder to fit a new lnb.
i must must say to you fella, please please buy the black ultra lnb, they are f***ing quality.
My dish moved in past due to wind and have tighten the bolts up and it hasn't moved, then i wanted to try this lnb people were going on about, think mine was £13 delivered on ebay.
So now i totally screwed the signal on the dish after fitting new lnb as mine is approx 12ft on side of house and limited space due to wall separating mine and heighbours house so was tough, but getting someone out to pay again was annoying me, but had a friend come round slighty moving it about whilst i looked at the box and got the signals back to 60-70% signal on all sats.
I wanted to test how good this lnb was and i noticed that even on 60% i would get odd glitch as the olde well 1 year approx lnb would give me approx 60-65 agc i.e actual gain control, learnt that from google lol.
This black ultra agc is 90-99 on all sats and i never ever get one glitch even in the very windy days as i made sure the dish & pole are not gunna move lol.
Bear in mind i never tampered with a dish before, but doing the above gave me confidence to buy a 60cm mk4 sky dish and mount it near the motorised and now get 91-99 on signal and both dishes are at rear, house right next to them approx 10 foot gap so have the roof slight in way and i get bob on signals.
Defo get that lnb i mention fella first, then go up to teh dish and retighten the nuts.
Another tip as i work on older cars, hate new ones lol, is buy some ignition sealant in a spray can basically used for the coil, ht leads and dizzy cap to prevent moisture getting in and spray it over the connection where the plug connects to the lnb, this will stop any rain tampering wiht the signal.
Also spray your entire dish with laquer, this will as you know will stop water sitting on the dish and keep it rust free.
These are free tiem only, and very little money and kepe your gear in top nick for many years to come.
But your dish is moving and if a cheapo lnb which no doubt is from what is sold in kits the lnb will not be helping.
My pole for the motorised is not straight i.e plum by any means but i got the best signal i could on all sats and never any issues at all.
This is the lnb you need bud, trust me on this as i was lost also and took the plunge, but i only bought it to see what others were raving about and had to see why.
Signal increased and agc went up approx 20% and not once glitch in wind, rain ever since, think my little ideas help also lol

XXXXXX

Make sure your box is right as regards settings etc, if you need any live help pm me your live messenger addy and we'll chat there and i will give you as much help as possible.
Best wishes.

P.s going to look for that video i took to show you i think it was 29% signal and picture never once moved or froze etc

I should have said from the start (which I forgot about), its a communal dish (so that means technically I cant touch it), but its a new system in new houses, and as I said, I had to call the guy out and have the dish reset after the storms here a few weeks ago, and he also fitted a brand new LNB, I dont know what size the dish is exactly but it certainly isnt one of those normal small dishes like sky fit nowdays, its bigger than that, but as I say I cant tell exactly the size unless I was to go and get a big set of ladders and go in the nighbours property and climb up there and measure it, lol, to heck with that, lol.

All I have to go on as far as the signal is concerned with the vu+duo is that the FTA channels are excellent quality and strength, and also my freesat receiver also reports excellent quality and strength signals, and then when I go to the pay channels on the vu+duo the snr levels drop to maybe as low as 50+% and thats when I get picture breakup etc, (@ foxylady, I dont know if your talking about agc (strength) or snr (quality), its the quality that matters, not the strength, even when my pay channel snr's drop down the agc seems to stay up pretty high, again I dont know why that is, its a strange one, but I think surely after all that I keep explaining that must surely rule out the sat dish and lnb, no/yes ???

Anyway foxylady, wheres this video your on about so we can see it, lol ?
I will pm you my msn messenger addy, thanks :)

[Sicilian]

If you want my honest opinion here I think there issue is from what you are connecting too and got nothing to do with the receiver or dish, but we wont go into detail with that here.

[BRAVEHEART]

And I just checked again just now and you know what ?

The signals are all back to being great on pay channels and FTA on the vu duo, this is nutz man, lol :lol3::eek::lol3:

[Maxwell]

So now you decide to tell us about being on a communal dish :rolleyes:
How many people are fed by this dish ?
Is it the LNB feeding a single cable to each apartment ie multi output
Is it a single or twin cable into a SMATV system.
If its a SMATV system there could be a dodgy switch at the headend which could cause problems if the neigbours are watching another channel particularly if its on a different polarity/band.
Ask your neighbours if any of them are having problems
change tuner on the duo and leave the other disconnected and see what happens, its unlikely to have 2 dodgy tuners
Check your broadband connection if using a 'specialist service'
Try reinstalling your Softcam and check the EMM logs.
And stop using the FTA as a reference as I explained earlier unless the encryption data is good within the signal you can get what you describe.

[Foxylady]

This is showing quality i.e. snr which is why i took it to prove how good the lnb's are.
If your on a communial dish, that's your issue for sure, as how many people are on that one dish lol.
Here's me thinking you got your own bud


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGwXIqUatFE

This is my setup, as you can see the motorised is not plum, but i got a got signal as best i know how without any meter's etc.
The standard dish is one from ebay approx £20 and standard lnb comes with it, on that i get 90% on nearly all channels, fta i get above 95%
As you can see not one bit of rust appearing on motorised due to spraying laquer on, this was put up approx 17 month ago.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a334/Pedrosgolf/SANY0010.jpg

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a334/Pedrosgolf/SANY0006.jpg

[BRAVEHEART]

Foxylady, thanks for your video and the photos :) ;)

Wait though, hmmmm, either I'm losing my marbles as I get older or summit or I am looking at things back to front with the vu duo :eek:

For mega years I was always under the impression that its better to have as low an SNR as possible as it means less noise = better quality, just like yours is loads lower than mines is foxylady.

But, for some reason (dont know why they would do this), but for some reason with the vu+ duo I thought they must have turned that reading basically upside down, I.E - its better to get the snr % rating higher rather than the normal (lower is better) (although in reality it would still mean lower is better but just that 100% is better than 0% SNR in the vu duo's case), in other words with the Vu+ Duo I thought it was best to get the Snr up the scale towards the 100% mark if you can, I.E - the higher the better.

Could someone confirm for me if I am correct or totally wrong with this and it is infact the normal old way even with the vu duo that the lower the snr the better, I.E - the closer to 0% you are is actually better ?

I am confused now, lol, cause if my SNR was any lower than about 55% then I would defo start to get signs of picture freezing and/or no picture at all, either that or they must have wired up my SNR back to front just to have fun with me, hahahahhaha :p

Someones gotta clarify this please, silly as it sounds, but yes, my system just would not operate with the snr anywhere near as low as foxyladys and I proved that myself since the weekend, although I have to say that last night and today so far the snr is looking pretty good now again on the pay channels, how long that lasts is anyones guess though, lol, hope its for a long time :thumbsup:

[Foxylady]

Brave your getting utterly confused lol.
That video was to show how good the Inverto ultra black lnb is as regard pulling in teh best strength via AGC.
As i would never able to do this with other lnb's, soon as mine would go round the 50% it would lose signal, glitch etc.
The video was no a means to say this is how your snr should be :nono:
Once i took video i set the dish to max snr i could getin order to get tip top signal as i would have not left it at the percentage i had in the video as it was a demo for others to show them the quality of the new lnb.
My snr i got max on motorised is round the 70-80% and even on foreign i get 90's.
Your issue lies in the dish you are sharing for sure bud.
Is there no way you can replace the dish yourself as they only £20-25, could be an older dish and lnb, maybe dish loose depending where it is located.
Maybe loose cabling from lnb to junction box or whatever is be used in order to split the signal how many ways.
Can you take pic of your dish aslong as it is not on top of a tower block which in that case you could ask caretaker if he can open door to get to the roof.
After all it will benefit everyone and mostly you.
I am sure there are other knowledgable people here whom can explain in greater details how it works, but all my information is from me learning little bits here and there and doing some stuff my self as i am in this field no expert.

[BRAVEHEART]

Brave your getting utterly confused lol.
That video was to show how good the Inverto ultra black lnb is as regard pulling in teh best strength via AGC.
As i would never able to do this with other lnb's, soon as mine would go round the 50% it would lose signal, glitch etc.
The video was no a means to say this is how your snr should be :nono:
Once i took video i set the dish to max snr i could getin order to get tip top signal as i would have not left it at the percentage i had in the video as it was a demo for others to show them the quality of the new lnb.
My snr i got max on motorised is round the 70-80% and even on foreign i get 90's.
Your issue lies in the dish you are sharing for sure bud.
Is there no way you can replace the dish yourself as they only £20-25, could be an older dish and lnb, maybe dish loose depending where it is located.
Maybe loose cabling from lnb to junction box or whatever is be used in order to split the signal how many ways.
Can you take pic of your dish aslong as it is not on top of a tower block which in that case you could ask caretaker if he can open door to get to the roof.
After all it will benefit everyone and mostly you.
I am sure there are other knowledgable people here whom can explain in greater details how it works, but all my information is from me learning little bits here and there and doing some stuff my self as i am in this field no expert.

Ahh I see, thank goodness for that, lol, thought I had totally lost me marbles there, hehehe, I thought you were on about your SNR (quality) and not AGC (strength), I get ya now though.

I have to say my AGC is always as high as yours in the video or even sometimes much higher like 99% depending on what channel etc.

As I mentioned in my last post, things with the SNR are looking good for past couple of days now, so who knows what happened, I dont, lol, but I will keep a close eye on it and report back if needed.;)

Once again I thank you for taking the time to talk to me and posting your video and photos etc, I shall send you a pm and get you added to my msn messenger list, do that in a little while, doing some work in the house just now.

[Donnie]

Here is a screenshot from my Duo, I have watched this channel for over 15 mins with no break up.
Really this does prove what I am saying.
A properly configured emu is the key to viewing your card or other channels

15351

[Donnie]

This is showing quality i.e. snr which is why i took it to prove how good the lnb's are.
If your on a communial dish, that's your issue for sure, as how many people are on that one dish lol.
Here's me thinking you got your own bud


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGwXIqUatFE

This is my setup, as you can see the motorised is not plum, but i got a got signal as best i know how without any meter's etc.
The standard dish is one from ebay approx £20 and standard lnb comes with it, on that i get 90% on nearly all channels, fta i get above 95%
As you can see not one bit of rust appearing on motorised due to spraying laquer on, this was put up approx 17 month ago.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a334/Pedrosgolf/SANY0010.jpg

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a334/Pedrosgolf/SANY0006.jpg


You were not joking when you said it was not plumb :D

[Foxylady]

I know i wasn't lmao.
I got good signals and get all the sats without issue, not bad for a non expert lol.
But i made sure it is bolted tight as no point in paying out more money to have someone get it straight as it is working for good few months now perfectly.
Did pretty spot on with the uk dish thou, give me some credit :D

[BRAVEHEART]

well here we go with this thread again, please read the whole thing if you havent read it before so that you know whats been going on, thanks.

I have tried everything now !

Tried both feeds one at a time in each tuner ( A & B) and exact same result tonight (i have twin feeds from the LNB), poor snr levels on the pay channels, few channels earlier were even breaking up etc like I have said before.

Strange thing is though as I have mentioned before too is that past couple of days the snr levels were actually pretty good or at least as good as they used to be like 70%-75% etc, sometimes more, again I am talking about the pay channels.

The FTA channels are litrally off the scale, they have excellent strength and quality on both the vu duo and on my freesat receiver too and thats on either feed as I have twin feeds from the LNB.

I am really struggling now for an answer to this and if we get another tech out to work on the dish, LNB and/or cabling then if there is no fault found we will be charged.

Its like lets say the guy comes out and its all working good like it was for past couple of days then hes going to stick a meter on the feeds etc and say "no problem here" and that will be that, we would have to hope that its a bad day when the guy comes out and then maybe he might detect something somewhere, I dont know.

Maybe we could try telling the guy whats been happening if everything happens to be ok when he comes out, we could say just exactly what I have been saying in this thread all along, but question is, will he go for that ?? are these contractors that are sent out more liable to want to do extra work to get more money or are they likely to just check at the feeds in the house (if its a good day) and say nothing wrong here and therefore we get charged for the callout and he goes away without doing nothing ?

I would be happy if the guy said ok I will replace everything, cabling, the dish, the pole, the LNB, the electrical box in the attick, everything, as it wouldnt then be coming out my pocket because he would be saying there was some sort of fault, I just dont know how much these guys will bend the rules if you ask them too, I guess thats what I am trying to say, lol.

But, still, to me it all seems so very strange why this is just happening on the pay channels and not at all on the FTA channels on the duo, or the channels on the freesat receiver, now, I'm not a sat dish installer guy etc, but to me that statment alone says theres nothing the matter with the dish, LNB or cabling, but who am I, lol, nobody.

I guess we could tell him its happening intermittantly as that is infact the truth, and then see what he does from there, eh ?

What should he do in that circumstance then ? because if you tell me what to say then I will tell him to do it and then hope for the best, cause theres one thing for sure, something aint right, but what that is I only wished I knew :(

p.s
I even put in the latest xml sat freq file too and that didnt make one bit of a difference at all either, got a few extra channels yes but the snr that I am on about stayed the same poor level.

[Rob van der Does]

I even put in the latest xml sat freq file too and that didnt make one bit of a difference at all either, got a few extra channels yes but the snr that I am on about stayed the same poor level.
1- As the satellites.xml is only used when scanning, this means you've done a scan. I didn't notice you mentioning that.
2- How could you expect this to have any influence on signal quality?

Don't forget: on tuning to a station only the lamedb is being used.

[BRAVEHEART]

1- As the satellites.xml is only used when scanning, this means you've done a scan. I didn't notice you mentioning that.
2- How could you expect this to have any influence on signal quality?

Don't forget: on tuning to a station only the lamedb is being used.

Thanks for the reply.;)

1. after installing the latest sat xml yes I did do a scan, purpose of even doing this is that I am running out of options and only trying things that other people have mentioned and ive been in sheer hope that something/anything helps, I am only a novice so therefore can only try different things in the hope that something works, thats all, I hope that answers question 1 & 2 for you a bit clearer.

3. I wasnt too sure what you meant with "lamedb" so I googled it, I think but still am not too sure if this is what your getting at, after installing the sat xml file I then done a scan etc, I then compared the snr levels from the channels in my bouqets with channels in my "ALL" channel list and could see there was no difference what so ever to the snr levels, there is always just 2 channels I need to check although when the snr gets poor it effects all pay channel snr levels as i have mentioned multiple times, but for quickness I just check sky movies drama HD and sky sports 3 HD and then if they are bad then I know the rest will be too, saves a lot of channel hopping. (hope that kind of answers your question about the lamedb thing as I am not too sure).

But anyway, here we go again, just now today at this precise time, the weather is a little breezy (not very breezy, just a bit), bit cloudy with sunny intervals and rain showers now and then, Ideal weather really as in that its not bad weather, but guess what, those snr levels on all the pay channels are all back up to nice and good snr now, yet approx when I left my last message the snr levels were all garbage, and the weather is just the same really apart from it now being daytime obviously, lol, weird situation, eh ??

Anyhow, to get back to my last post, I think I will do what I was talking about and just call out the sat installer guy again like I said as I am getting sick of going on about this, could someone please read my last post and then tell me exactly what to say to the sat installer company guy please ?

I will basically just say to him that I have a family member that suggested a few things that either are needing checked, fixed or replaced or whatever you guys tell me exactly what to say to the guy, and my covering story is quite obvious, my family member I shall say works for sky but says he cannot touch the dish or cabling etc as its a communal dish and also on a neighbouring building too and he cannot touch it as hes simply not allowed to, but I will make out that after explaining everything to my family member, he came round on a day when the snr levels were bad and attached some sorts of meters or something like that to the sat feed at the tv (I will play dumb and read from a note, lol), and then say my family member said that it either has to be >

1. xxxxxx
2. xxxxxx
3. xxxxxx
or
4. xxxxxx
or all of the above
( xxxxx = possible problems obviously, lol)

now all I need is for you guys to tell me exactly what to say now please and then I can make the call tommorow or whenever, can you do this for me ?

Appreciate it, thanks.;)

[Rob van der Does]

Just to explain: the satellites.xml is the complete satellite and transponder database of the box. When doing a scan, the data in there is used: the box tunes to the transponders, listens for services and if received saves them.
When tuning to a service (as you normally do when zapping) the data of the lamedb (in etc/enigma2) is used. Only the satellite position from the satellites.xml is also used then.

In other words: even if no transponders at all are in the satellites.xml, zapping goes on as usual. You won't even notice it. Hence there's also no influence on the signal quality when changing the data in the file.

[Foxylady]

Brave,
We'll discuss on live fella and go through all the motions to resolve the issue bud.

[Maxwell]

Just a thought with you mentioning the weather being a bit cloudy/rainy, it is possible that you need an attenuator fitting, you could possibly have too much signal which is just as bad and has the same symptoms as not enough.

[Foxylady]

With it being communial it is no the same as single household as lots of cables/signals are being split are running off one dish, you need to find out what they are using to save the signal being dropped and to be devided evenly as the cabling will be massive and as it goes longer the weak the signal
Tell them to check your cabling going to your property as if no one else is complaining about it, tell them to re-wire yours or even get off there backside and fix the fault they were originally paid for as never ever have i with any type of box inc any vu's have suffered snr issues UNLESS the dish was out of alignment due to winds, break in cable or water getting into the lnb etc.
You can never ever rule a faulty box never, no matter how good they are, like with anything.
From speaking to you, your box is setup right, man even my 12 year old could do it so i am not disputing even thou your not an expert like i am not, you know what your doing like i do as regards images etc.
Tell the sat people you've spoken to friends and others on the net that know there stuff and you want the fault finding as it is clearly points toward your dish, cabling etc as mentioned before fella.
But obviously they are iusing some type of booster and this could be the issue, as your feed has to go through some kind of power booster in order to boost signals to all properties when on one dish
If no joy slap your own up mate, be selfish and have a dish for yourself, least you know it fresh cabling, new dish and lnb and no issues.

[wazza_2]

i would really consider getting that pole plum other wise your lnb is not set straight it will be picking more satelittes from one side and less from the other and i would defo get a INVERTO Black Ultra High lnb , i put one on mine this weekend and gained 10% extra on all sats. the best way i found to see if my dish is set right is to level out the signal between 28east and 30west, if you get them two right everything else should flow.

[digi247]

Here is a screenshot from my Duo, I have watched this channel for over 15 mins with no break up.
Really this does prove what I am saying.
A properly configured emu is the key to viewing your card or other channels

15351

Donnie i have no idea where your located but if your in the UK and using a Mini dish for 28.2° east and only getting 39% snr you have a serious problem you should be gettting on the Duo's SNR level around the 80% mark


i would really consider getting that pole plum other wise your lnb is not set straight it will be picking more satelittes from one side and less from the other and i would defo get a INVERTO Black Ultra High lnb , i put one on mine this weekend and gained 10% extra on all sats. the best way i found to see if my dish is set right is to level out the signal between 28east and 30west, if you get them two right everything else should flow.


Wazza if you look closely at the Pics its an Orbital dish with an Inverto Black Ultra, Just a bit worrying about the pole Not being Plumb and also the Spacing of the T&K's are a little on the short side, Ideally they should be at least a meter apart and with the motor in between the T&K and not above it helps balance the wind load and minimise vibration. But each to there own.

[Huevos]

Braveheart, if you are getting more than 30% SNR on Sky channels that is plenty for the tuner as these are 2/3 FEC. What you need to know is if the problem only affects pay channels.

When you are having trouble with a channel press the up arrow, then green (satellites), then select current transponder and flick through all the channels on that trying to find one that is not encrypted. This will tell you if the glitching is to do with local interference or a problem with the way your softcam is set up to read your subscription card.

[BRAVEHEART]

Braveheart, if you are getting more than 30% SNR on Sky channels that is plenty for the tuner as these are 2/3 FEC. What you need to know is if the problem only affects pay channels.

When you are having trouble with a channel press the up arrow, then green (satellites), then select current transponder and flick through all the channels on that trying to find one that is not encrypted. This will tell you if the glitching is to do with local interference or a problem with the way your softcam is set up to read your subscription card.

Mate, I appreciate your input, but if you read the thread correctly I have said repeatedly that it is only pay channels and not FTA mate ;)

This just started to happen a week ago and then someone in here suggested I update to the latest vix image which I have done few days ago and it didnt make any difference either, and also have the enigma2-plugin-cams-cccam.2.1.4_1.1-r2 installed, and latest sat xml file etc etc etc, pretty sure its all set up correctly, well put it this way, it was ok on the old image up until a week ago and then the problems started and since then I have updated everything and that hasnt helped either, so I'm still at a lose as to what the heck is causing this prob, its a strange one :(

p.s
I dont know how the heck you can say you can watch pay channels with an snr of 30% on a vuo duo, no chance mate, please show me/us the proof as I cant beleive that until I see it, soon as mines goes anywhere near 55% or less the picture will freeze up or the channel just wont appear, maybe you have some kind of magic fix for this, if so can you please tell me more as that would sort me right out mate, cheers :)

[BRAVEHEART]

Mate, I appreciate your input, but if you read the thread correctly I have said repeatedly that it is only pay channels and not FTA mate ;)

This just started to happen a week ago and then someone in here suggested I update to the latest vix image which I have done few days ago and it didnt make any difference either, and also have the enigma2-plugin-cams-cccam.2.1.4_1.1-r2 installed, and latest sat xml file etc etc etc, pretty sure its all set up correctly, well put it this way, it was ok on the old image up until a week ago and then the problems started and since then I have updated everything and that hasnt helped either, so I'm still at a lose as to what the heck is causing this prob, its a strange one :(

p.s
I dont know how the heck you can say you can watch pay channels with an snr of 30% on a vuo duo, no chance mate, please show me/us the proof as I cant beleive that until I see it, soon as mines goes anywhere near 55% or less the picture will freeze up or the channel just wont appear, maybe you have some kind of magic fix for this, if so can you please tell me more as that would sort me right out mate, cheers :)

isnt there a simple snr booster or summit I can buy that will sort this (cost doesnt matter), getting super pizzed off with it now man even though snr signals are good tonight, gauranteed they will be rubbish again later on or tomorrow or whatever, Ive never heard of such a booster and therfore dont think there is such a thing, I am sure someone will put me wise to the answer though please ?

[Foxylady]

Wazza,
I still get same sats i did when it was plum.
Like i say fella i don't see the need or importance to shell out more money on it if it is doing the job, which it is very well. :thumbsup:

Brave,
Boosters do exist for the sat setup

[Huevos]

I dont know how the heck you can say you can watch pay channels with an snr of 30% on a vuo duo, no chance mate, please show me/us the proof as I cant beleive that until I see it, soon as mines goes anywhere near 55% or less the picture will freeze up or the channel just wont appear, maybe you have some kind of magic fix for this, if so can you please tell me more as that would sort me right out mate, cheers :)It's up to you what you want to believe! FEC 2/3 is stable down to about 28%, but if you've got local noise on the constellation you will get pixelisation even when you have 99% SNR. The PSB channels are on a much higher power satellite so will of course be less prone to interference.

Anyway as I said above when the interference happens test other channels on the "current transponder" to see if they are acting in the same fashion.

And there is no such thing as an SNR booster. There are signal boosters but they boost noise too so SNR will remain the same. The only way to boost SNR is a bigger dish or less noisy components in the signal chain.

[BRAVEHEART]

It's up to you what you want to believe! FEC 2/3 is stable down to about 28%, but if you've got local noise on the constellation you will get pixelisation even when you have 99% SNR. The PSB channels are on a much higher power satellite so will of course be less prone to interference.

Anyway as I said above when the interference happens test other channels on the "current transponder" to see if they are acting in the same fashion.

And there is no such thing as an SNR booster. There are signal boosters but they boost noise too so SNR will remain the same. The only way to boost SNR is a bigger dish or less noisy components in the signal chain.

I would still love to see someone show us proof of a vu duo running pay channels with an snr of 30% without any picture freeze up etc if they can please ? This would be interesting.;)

[Huevos]

running pay channels with an snr of 30% without any picture freeze upWhether or not a channel is a subscription service has no bearing on signal quality required to receive it.

[BRAVEHEART]

Whether or not a channel is a subscription service has no bearing on signal quality required to receive it.

I know that, but as we were talking about pay channels I stuck with that, but I would love to see any channel at 30% snr on vu duo.

[Rob van der Does]

I would still love to see someone show us proof of a vu duo running pay channels with an snr of 30% without any picture freeze up etc if they can please ? This would be interesting.;)
You'd better believe an experienced guy as Huevos and take his advise instead of asking for proof. And don't forget he mentioned the FEC 2/3 to be essential for low SNR-reception.

Better get your dish aligned properly! Did you notice how long this thread has become without you showing any result?

[BRAVEHEART]

You'd better believe an experienced guy as Huevos and take his advise instead of asking for proof. And don't forget he mentioned the FEC 2/3 to be essential for low SNR-reception.

Better get your dish aligned properly! Did you notice how long this thread has become without you showing any result?


yep, long time, only person thats posted anything is foxylady, I would still love to see a duo with any channel showing for a decent amount of time with snr of 30 or was it 28 he said.

I will post my findings back when I get my stuff fixed, not many people seem to like helping the inexperienced user in here I have found, but hey ho, thats the way it goes, thanks very much:)

p.s
you should have told me to get my dish religned sooner, I think I did say either in this thread or the other one that my dish was pro realigned just weeks ago, so if we cant trust these pro's then who can we trust ? I cant do it, If I was allowed to go near the dish then I could, but its not allowed as its a communal dish, but I used to play with dishes maybe 24 years ago or something like that, so I could do it, I am not as much of an idiot as you may think, typically inexperienced yes, but not stupid, as I think it was foxylady said, a 2 year kid could do this kind of thing with the proper equipment and legal authourity to touch dishes etc, both of which I dont have, no tools for the job and no permission to touch the communal dish.

If I had those things then I wouldnt even need to come in here and ask for any sort of help at all, and anyway, it seems like anytime a typical inexperienced user like me asks anything, no one is interested anyway, what is it ??? Do you need a degree in the art of satellite technology or something like that before someone will even have any interest in helping ?

I didnt see lots of people charging to my aid with help, you understand what I am saying ?

But as I said before, lol, hey ho, it looks as though thats the way it goes in here, I purchased my equipment from here, so I naturally thought it was the best place to ask things, maybe I was wrong, or maybe it could prove good in the end , I dont know.

[Rob van der Does]

not many people seem to like helping the inexperienced user in here I have found, but hey ho, that's the way it goes, thanks very much :)
I don't think you draw the right conclusion! First have a critical look at all your posts yourself :rolleyes:

[wazza_2]

have you tried swaping the lnb onto the single dish to see if that is giving you the fault, you never no it maybe faulty

[Maxwell]

@Braveheart - I think it a bit off for you to suggest you have received no help here, if you read back through this thread you will find that virtually every possibility that could cause your problem has been pointed out to you but you choose not to listen to the advice or even attempt to do anything about it.
In fact you didnt even provide all the facts until halfway through and we are not mindreaders. As you readily admit you are inexperienced and unable to touch your external equipment its time you got the original installer in to check the dish and LNB and in particular the headend distribution equipment which is where I suspect your problem is.

[Foxylady]

I know that, but as we were talking about pay channels I stuck with that, but I would love to see any channel at 30% snr on vu duo.


I have already Brave in my video, it it is on Discovery HD showing 28%.
I could have easily left mine for long period but why would i do that if i can ahieve the higher signals plus i didn't want dish sitting there loose for days on end lol.
I was showing what i could have never done with other lnb's, thus i was happy with my purchase at the time and still am.
But if any of my dishes went down to 50'ish on standard lnb i would get break up in picture also.
I think the above was achieved merely due to the new lnb on the motorised.
Ask your installer/s if you have a zone 2 or 60cm dish as your up in scotland and maybe just maybe you have been given a minidish/zone1 which is pointless.
If you have a mini i would suggest replacing it for bigger.
The standard dish i have in pic is a 60cm as i did have a mini on there and since i fitted bigger one the signal shot up 20% plus as i have an house directly in the way.
And i am in middle of the country and would only need a mini, but getting bigger dish was defo an improvement.

[BRAVEHEART]

@ foxy, its defo not a mini dish, I think I already stated that in either this thread or the other one too, its a bigger dish, again I cant get up there to measure it but its certainly not a mini dish or anywhere near it.

@ maxwell, I just mean in general mate, the vibes I get in here is unless you are a high tech sat person then no one is interested, maybe I am wrong, but thats just the feeling I get sometimes, I dont mean you personally or anyone personally, thats just the feeling I get thats all.

and @ foxy again, I am glad you stated "But if any of my dishes went down to 50'ish on standard lnb i would get break up in picture also.", because to me 28 or 30 like rob van & Huevos quote seems to me from what I have experienced just unbelievable, thats the reason why I said I would love to see that to prove it.

@ rob van, I am sorry if you feel that I didnt speak very nicely, but I just feel sometimes that people who either do know better or think they know better think its very easy to tramp or talk down to others like me who are not so experienced as them, thats all, actually I shouldnt apologise for that as that is exactly my feelings, but me being me I always end up saying sorry to people even though I feel as if they are trying to talk down to me like a teacher talking down to a pupil at school.

Anyway, hope that sorts all those problems out, lol, it still hasnt sorted my problems out, but as I said I will or may post back my findings when I get things sorted or attempt to.

Please try and remember when talking to people, and I dont just mean me, that lots of people are just starting out and dont have a clue, so treating people either like they are stupid or things like that isnt always very nice, I am just glad that I do infact know a little bit about it, god help the people that havent even had a sat dish, lol, there again maybe for some strange reason they would get offered more help than me, or maybe thats just my paranoid mind over reacting :confused:

[BRAVEHEART]

I will give up now and wont come back until I have the thing fixed of my own accord, thanks :)

[Donnie]

Donnie i have no idea where your located but if your in the UK and using a Mini dish for 28.2° east and only getting 39% snr you have a serious problem you should be gettting on the Duo's SNR level around the 80% mark

It's only a problem if it affects my viewing which it does not.

The OP is obsessed as everyone else is that the breakup is due to signal but at no point has he looked at my suggestion that it is due to his emu configuration.

Breakup, freezing and pixelation can all be caused by the emu.

[Sicilian]

I feel this thread has run its course and as I've stated in this thread previously, your issue is ONLY with PAY channels so go check whatever your connected to. If it where a signal issue NOT all pay channels would be affected and some of your FTA channels would also be affected. So I suggest you get your own subscription card.

[BRAVEHEART]

Snr has dropped like a stone tonight again, and I think what is happening is that the signals on my main FTA channels are mostly so strong and amazing snr too that although they are possibly dropping a bit too as well as the pay channels I'm just not noticing it as much with the FTA channels, I dare say if I was to take lots of notes of levels etc then no doubt the FTA's would have dropped a bit too even though they still remain strong, think someone said earlier or in another thread that the pay channels are always weaker than FTA most of the time anyway, so maybe thats whats happening and I aint noticing it just so much.

Anyhow, I am just going to call out the dish installers to get them to work on it, will probably be at least a few days or maybe a week before they come out though, so we shall see.

[BRAVEHEART]

Well a pro sat installer was out today and guess what ?

yes he found no fault at all with the dish from inside the house end here, says he will need to come back to test the dish and/or LNB as I said that of course you may find its ok just now as the fault is "intermittent".

After explaining to him what intermittent actually meant in the dictionary he said yea yea yea I know what you mean, but he said its like this, if I test something that isnt broke how can I fix it ?

I said well for starters you can replace parts etc, maybe even full new dish,LNB, pole and cabling etc, but he said he cant do that as nothing is showing as faulty, but again I refered back to the word "intermittent".

So I guess I need to wait again now, wish I would have just bought a clone dream 800 now :(, or possibly even a Virgin box :(

[Donnie]

The reason he can not find a problem is there is no problem to find, with the lack of info coming from you and the info I have from your PM I would put money on the fact the problem is you emu setup and nothing to do with the dish or associated parts.

I have told you what I need to be able to assist and you are either not interested or unwilling to give me that information either here or via pm.

I suggest this thread is closed as it serves no purpose.

[BRAVEHEART]

Donnie, with respect mate, I was only keeping "MY THREAD" up to date as I said I would, maybe you are not interested but maybe some people are, and maybe just maybe someone will or would like to tell me what to say to the sat installer guy when he comes back to force him to fix the problem that there obviously is and I have also been advised from several members about on here (not you) is actually the matter, I dont find anything the matter with that, does anyone else ?

I am litrally hitting my head against a brick wall here trying to figure out what is the problem with my setup.:mad:

p.s
and frankly for you to say "MY THREAD" serves no purpose, serves no purpose to who ?? You, someone else or the guy across the road ? it serves a purpose to me mate and thats all that matters, I dont appreciate your comment in that respect, as I said in my private message to you, why not even post any message at all if you hate me so much ? I wouldnt comment on any of your posts if it annoyed me so much, simple as that.

But lets not turn this into the circus that you have already tried to make it, thanks for your help and I hope you enjoy yourself.:D

[Sicilian]

Thread closed, its runs its course and the op should follow the advice given.