Twin tuner configuration advice

[qpush]

Hi Guys, still doing my best trying to configure the Ultimo :)

Tomorrow (Friday) the sat guy is coming to set up a second dish on my roof...
The second dish will be fixed towards 19.2 with a twin LNB... my current dish is motorized with a single LNB.

Have I understood it correctly when I say that with a single LNB you can record one channel of choice and simultaneously only watch another channel within the same transponder? Now, if I add a twin LNB can I then record one channel and watch any other channel on the same satellite even if they are on different transponders?

By adding a twin LNB to my motorized dish, would I then be able to do the following:
record 2 channels simultaneously on 19.2e (fixed dish) and at the same time record another channel on 0.8w while I watch whichever channel on the same sat?

What would be the result of having a quad LNB on one or both of the dishes?

Over to the internal HDD... how do you normally manage that?
I installed the mediaplayer plugin to access recordings... is there some other way to access it in an easy way?
How do you delete recordings from within the GUI?
How do you do to record something which is scheduled to air in lets say 2 weeks from now and how would you know what will be aired in 2 weeks from now?

Ohh.. strange... the internal HDD is 2TB and it shows "capacity: 2000.398 GB - Free: -1 MB ???? did a 5 minute test recording only ... do I have to format it or something?

Thanks for your patience / Q

[silverfox0786]

Hi Guys, still doing my best trying to configure the Ultimo :)

Tomorrow (Friday) the sat guy is coming to set up a second dish on my roof...
The second dish will be fixed towards 19.2 with a twin LNB... my current dish is motorized with a single LNB.

Have I understood it correctly when I say that with a single LNB you can record one channel of choice and simultaneously only watch another channel within the same transponder? Now, if I add a twin LNB can I then record one channel and watch any other channel on the same satellite even if they are on different transponders?

you are correct in yr understanding there


By adding a twin LNB to my motorized dish, would I then be able to do the following:
record 2 channels simultaneously on 19.2e (fixed dish) and at the same time record another channel on 0.8w while I watch whichever channel on the same sat?

for this you will as a twin on 19 be able to watch 2 different transponders on 19e yes
for twin lnb on yr motor you can only watch at teh same time 2 different transpoders from the same sat you are on as they dish teh moment it moves will loose the first transpoder
or you can watch yr motor and record on 19 as that a diferent dish altogether


What would be the result of having a quad LNB on one or both of the dishes?

i dont see the point in quad as it wont make much benifit to you considering what you want to setup

tripple tuner you original thought is best 2 on 19e and 1 as motor


Over to the internal HDD... how do you normally manage that?
I installed the mediaplayer plugin to access recordings... is there some other way to access it in an easy way?
How do you delete recordings from within the GUI?
How do you do to record something which is scheduled to air in lets say 2 weeks from now and how would you know what will be aired in 2 weeks from now?

Thanks for your patience / Q


you can format and initialise the hdd within box

there is a record list button to see the recording and pressing menu allows you to do things like delete move etc
there is alow colour short cut keys that will be labled on screen

using vix you will see all this and infact dont need media player plugin as vix hsa its own media player which works brill

[qpush]

Thanks for your reply silverfox -
I managed to initialize the HDD and it looks like it did the trick... thanks for confirming the LNB issue, twin LNB it is...

So how do you add a recording days or even weeks before a program is aired?

Thanks!

[silverfox0786]

ahhh i knew i forgot to answer a question

short green button is timer to add a timer as long as you got pull populated epg you can add and search as far as yr epg goes

or set a manual recording by entering data in manually for what ever date channel and time you want

long green button is autotimer [linux way of saying series link]

set up the same way but instead searches yr epg for all teh same titles and adds to record list

[Huevos]

By adding a twin LNB to my motorized dish, would I then be able to do the following:
record 2 channels simultaneously on 19.2e (fixed dish) and at the same time record another channel on 0.8w while I watch whichever channel on the same sat?Regardless of the aerial system you also have to consider the hardware limitations of the receiver.

1 tuner = 1 transponder. So if you want to record from 2 transponders on 19.2E and record from 1 transponder on 0.8W at the same time you need 3 tuners.

Also, if you are thinking of having a twin LNB for 19E and a motorised LNB how are you thinking of interfacing these to the Ultimo? Are you going for 3 tuners? Or will you just have 2 tuners and be sharing one tuner between the 19E fixed dish and the motorised one?

[qpush]

Que cuentas Huevos :)

Well... turns out I don't have a clue about anything, although I thought I had it figured out...

This is what the sat-guy will do for me:
1. keep my motorized dish but connect it to the DM800 in the bedroom... this is the dish that is connected to the Ultimo in the living-room right now.
2. Install a new dish (wave frontier or something like that) with a cluster of twin/dual LNB's and connect it to the Ultimo (Tuner A + B) in the living-room.

I will just have to trust him on this one... opinions/comments are welcome though!

Thanks

[Larry-G]

you can go with any of those setups but remember most sat installers will say what ever they believe will persuade you to spend money.

[basilyoung]

the wave frontier dish with a cluster of lnb,s is an expencive chioce, but very g0od as well, but with the motorized dish going to your 800 exclusively is a bad move, for the following reasons, and also begs a question

Q; with the wave frontier dish/lnb cluster is it his intention to set these up to the 2 inputs, ie; 19/28/13/16 east to one input, and say, 23/1 west/9 east/5 east to the other? if so, it defeats the object of a twin tuner, as it would restrict your freedom to record say 1 channel on 19 east whilst watching another on 19 east

the ideal, in my opinion, is to have a dual lnb on the motorized dish,with the ultimo controlling the dish or a loop through to the 800
second dish, would be either a second moterized dish/fixed dish with multy lnb,s ( which can be done on a standard dish for a lot less than the wave frontier dish )

[qpush]

you can go with any of those setups but remember most sat installers will say what ever they believe will persuade you to spend money.

I'm actually not choosing between the two but thats rather the way it will be set up... one motorized single LNB for one receiver and the fixed "clustered-LNB-dish" for the spanking new vu+.

Setting up (materials+labor) the clustered-LNB-dish (Torodial?) will cost about EUR 400 which is more expensive then the average set-up but the advantage is that it's a flexible system where I will start out with covering 5 satellites and if needed can add coverage for another 5 satellites by adding more LNB's. What I like best about this set-up is that the 5 satellites are all available immediately without having to wait for the dish to rotate.

[basilyoung]

please also concider my previous post

[qpush]

the wave frontier dish with a cluster of lnb,s is an expencive chioce, but very g0od as well, but with the motorized dish going to your 800 exclusively is a bad move, for the following reasons, and also begs a question

Q; with the wave frontier dish/lnb cluster is it his intention to set these up to the 2 inputs, ie; 19/28/13/16 east to one input, and say, 23/1 west/9 east/5 east to the other? if so, it defeats the object of a twin tuner, as it would restrict your freedom to record say 1 channel on 19 east whilst watching another on 19 east

the ideal, in my opinion, is to have a dual lnb on the motorized dish,with the ultimo controlling the dish or a loop through to the 800
second dish, would be either a second moterized dish/fixed dish with multy lnb,s ( which can be done on a standard dish for a lot less than the wave frontier dish )

Oh boy... I'm getting more and more confused :)

I need a clarification in order to understand how things are working:

In the case of ONE motorized dish with a single LNB (this is what I have now) connected to tuner A, I can record one show and at the same time watch another show within the same transponder... nothing else.

If I add a dual LNB to the dish does it then have one or two cables coming out of it? If the answer is two cables, then what happens with them? Are they connected to some kind of box or similar and then one cable continues to my tuner A.. or is one cable going to Tuner A and the other cable to Tuner B?
Or does a dual LNB only have one cable coming out of it?

I'm extremely confused right now so sorry... / Thanks

[Larry-G]

Oh boy... I'm getting more and more confused :)

I need a clarification in order to understand how things are working:

In the case of ONE motorized dish with a single LNB (this is what I have now) connected to tuner A, I can record one show and at the same time watch another show within the same transponder... nothing else.

If I add a dual LNB to the dish does it then have one or two cables coming out of it? If the answer is two cables, then what happens with them? Are they connected to some kind of box or similar and then one cable continues to my tuner A.. or is one cable going to Tuner A and the other cable to Tuner B?
Or does a dual LNB only have one cable coming out of it?

I'm extremely confused right now so sorry... / Thanks

one cable goes from the receiver to the motor then the lnb to power the motor, the second feed you can either rout to a second receiver ( obviously you cant drive the motor with this one ) or hook it up to another tuner in the same box as the first feed to allow record functions on two independent transponders both feeds will always be from the same satellite regardless of where it points to.

[qpush]

...both feeds will always be from the same satellite regardless of where it points to.

But isn't that the advantage with the torodial antenna as its fixed (no motor) but receive signal from all (configured) satellites at the same time?
So back to your questin there Basil... yes I think the idea was to equip this torodial dish with 5 dual LNB's - so covering 5 satellites simultaneously and connect both to tuner A and B.

Makes me believe you would have a quite flexible system where you could record from two different satellites at the same time while you watch ... yea... what would you watch? anything as long as its from the same transponder as the two you are currently recording or could you watch something from a third satellite or anything from the two satellites your recording from even though its not on the same transponder?

[basilyoung]

the options are many, and what you were looking at, ( going on the installers surgestion ) is the possibilty of having to call him back out, due to not getting the best option, in the first place, like all things, its best to get it right first time

dual tuner units, you main aim should be to maximize freedom of chioce/recording and viewing totally independantly, to achieve this, your best options are

tuner A ( or B ) motorized, ( or diasque switch to multy lnb,s ) dual lnb,s are best, as it give extra options for second units
tuner B ( or A ) again as above, or perhaps a fixed dish

this way, you can have recordings on all available sats, or picture in picture ie; pip on say 28 east/19 east

with the spare lnb connections, these could be disqued to you DB800, therefore giving the second unit equal freedom, ( but with out control of a motorized dish

[Larry-G]

But isn't that the advantage with the torodial antenna as its fixed (no motor) but receive signal from all (configured) satellites at the same time?
So back to your questin there Basil... yes I think the idea was to equip this torodial dish with 5 dual LNB's - so covering 5 satellites simultaneously and connect both to tuner A and B.

Makes me believe you would have a quite flexible system where you could record from two different satellites at the same time while you watch ... yea... what would you watch? anything as long as its from the same transponder as the two you are currently recording or could you watch something from a third satellite or anything from the two satellites your recording from even though its not on the same transponder?

i'm not saying its the wrong way to go but it is a very expensive setup to instal and do you need it ?.

[qpush]

i'm not saying its the wrong way to go but it is a very expensive setup to instal and do you need it ?.

It is expensive but so was the Ultimo :)
To be honest, I don't know what I'm doing and unfortunately I'm not getting smarter either it seems...
whats a diseqC btw? would that be something that is incorporated into a multi LNB set-up?

[basilyoung]

It is expensive but so was the Ultimo :)
To be honest, I don't know what I'm doing and unfortunately I'm not getting smarter either it seems...
whats a diseqC btw? would that be something that is incorporated into a multi LNB set-up?

yes, its a switching method, to hop from one lnb to another ( also diasque is mis spelt which does,nt help )

and yes there are serious benifits to the multy lnb option, but unless you are going to have say 1 west through to 28 east, there are much cheaper options

[basilyoung]

It is expensive but so was the Ultimo :)
To be honest, I don't know what I'm doing and unfortunately I'm not getting smarter either it seems...
whats a diseqC btw? would that be something that is incorporated into a multi LNB set-up?

yes, its a switching method, to hop from one lnb to another ( also diasque is mis spelt which does,nt help )

and yes there are serious benifits to the multy lnb option, but unless you are going to have say 1 west through to 28 east, there are much cheaper options

http://www.world-of-satellite.co.uk/LNB/Inverto-Multiconnect-Systems

[qpush]

So Basil... I could then have a quad LNB --> diseqC ---> tuner A which would equal to being able to record from up to 4 transponders on the same satellite simultaneously.
And I would still have tuner B to play around with (motorized/fixed dish with dual LNB + diseqc then?) for even greater spread.
Please tell me I am getting the hang of this... :)

Thanks, I really appreciate the help you guys are giving me.

[basilyoung]

So Basil... I could then have a quad LNB --> diseqC ---> tuner A which would equal to being able to record from up to 4 transponders on the same satellite simultaneously.
And I would still have tuner B to play around with (motorized/fixed dish with dual LNB + diseqc then?) for even greater spread.
Please tell me I am getting the hang of this... :)

Thanks, I really appreciate the help you guys are giving me.

Yes you are getting there, my main concern, is that often, sat installers, only sell half the story, or worse, sell what they can do, rather than whats needed, and still worse, sometimes install, with a planned "call back", and blame the customer, for being unclear in the first place


I could then have a quad LNB --> diseqC ---> tuner A which would equal to being able to record from up to 4 transponders on the same satellite simultaneously.

yes, this could be as stated, or 4 seperate lnb,s ( there are options to have as many lnb,s ie; 16 lnbs via switching so giving instant switching on a single tuner, and if dual lnb,s, both tuners would have the same options, giving total freedom )

its also possible to run a motor/ diseqC on the same tuner, although much more advanced

[qpush]

Again, thanks Basil...
Seems I have a lot to think about before deciding for which way to go....
Well, tomorrow's a new day...

[basilyoung]

yes,..but you are going on the correct route

investigate best options first, then act

many only come here, after they acted, it then gets expencive, its been a pleasure chatting

[Rob van der Does]

What I'm missing in this whole thread is: why not add the third tuner to the Ultimo? You spend so much money to get a flexible system to be able to watch & record many satellites, so why not this cheap (GBP29 if I remember well) addition?

[qpush]

What I'm missing in this whole thread is: why not add the third tuner to the Ultimo? You spend so much money to get a flexible system to be able to watch & record many satellites, so why not this cheap (GBP29 if I remember well) addition?

Sounds like a good idea Rob... but how would I take advantage of it in the best way?

If I go with the Wave frontier solution with 5 x dual LNB's connected to tuner A + B then how would I use the third tuner? must the third tuner have a cable stuck in to it or can it be somehow connected from the inside of the box with tuner A/B and somehow take advantage of their connection?

Thanks

[Larry-G]

you could either install a third DVB-S2 tuner card and use that for another satellite feed or you could buy the DVB-T/C combo card and use it as a terrestrial Tv or cable tuner for added flexibility ( although in the uk you would not be able to decode the cable feed on he box but the terrestrial option works a treat and without needing a USB terrestrial tuner card ).

[qpush]

you could either install a third DVB-S2 tuner card and use that for another satellite feed or you could buy the DVB-T/C combo card and use it as a terrestrial Tv or cable tuner for added flexibility ( although in the uk you would not be able to decode the cable feed on he box but the terrestrial option works a treat and without needing a USB terrestrial tuner card ).

I don't use T/C but would gladly add the S2 tuner...

[Huevos]

qpush, T90 costs a fair bit of money, but is great for zapping. Set up tuners A & B connected to the T90 and have tuner A as prefered. Then stick a 3rd tuner in the Ultimo and connect it to the motorised dish (tuner C). Now if you have chosen well which satellites will be available on the T90, the motorised dish will only be used pretty infrequently... so you can loop out of that tuner and into the Dreambox in the bedroom. Add a Nova-T USB stick (tuner D) for terrestrial recordings and you will have a pretty complete system.

[Rob van der Does]

No need to set tuner A as preferred in that setup: if set to "auto", which is the default, tuner A or B (wich males no difference) will be preferred by the box.

[Huevos]

No need to set tuner A as preferred in that setup: if set to "auto", which is the default, tuner A or B (wich males no difference) will be preferred by the box.I've never really understood this. In auto how does the receiver select the tuner? Is it the first available tuner? Or is it the tuner that has the smallest number of satellites available?

[Rob van der Does]

I've never really understood this. In auto how does the receiver select the tuner? Is it the first available tuner? Or is it the tuner that has the smallest number of satellites available?
Indeed: in "Auto" the tuner with the least possibility's will have prio 1 etc. Prio 1 means that the very first task will be given to that tuner (if possible of course), be it live-TV or recording.

This is a very simple protocol, that offers room for flaws: the box will only look at the situation at the moment a timer starts, and will not take future timers into consideration. But this flaw cannot be overcome by setting a priority by hand.
Example: there are two overlapping recordings; the first one can be done via tuner A but also via tuner B, the second one only via tuner B. If at the moment timer 1 starts you are watching TV via tuner A the recording will be done via tuner B. That means that tuner B isn't available any more for timer 2.
If the tuner-choice-process would take future timers into account, the live TV would have been done via tuner B.
Alternatives would be dynamical assignment of tuners (during a recording another tuner can take over) and/or the assignment of prio-tuners for recordings (although that would require some knowledge by the user).

[qpush]

qpush, T90 costs a fair bit of money, but is great for zapping. Set up tuners A & B connected to the T90 and have tuner A as prefered. Then stick a 3rd tuner in the Ultimo and connect it to the motorised dish (tuner C). Now if you have chosen well which satellites will be available on the T90, the motorised dish will only be used pretty infrequently... so you can loop out of that tuner and into the Dreambox in the bedroom. Add a Nova-T USB stick (tuner D) for terrestrial recordings and you will have a pretty complete system.

Yes... That more like it :)
I dont know if it makes sense but I was actually thinking about a one sat solution...
*install the T90 with 5 x Quad LNB's for my five pref. sats between 1w - 28e
*Install third tuner in the ultimo (delivery tomorrow)
*3 cables to the Ultimo (tuner A-C) and 1 cable to the Dreambox
*take down the motorized dish and sell it

If I cover my 5 preferred sats with the T90 I really have no need for a motorized dish as I never visit any of the other sats... and I think I will hate the time it takes to turn the dish once I get used to the T90 zap-speed.

Well, it wil all go down on Wednesday so full report wil be given then... perhaps with one or two pictures if there is any interest

Thanks

[bassethound]

Sounds like a nice set up to me but expensive

[Rob van der Does]

Of course that makes sense (apart from the fact that it's not a one-sat but a five-sat solution :confused: ).
You'll have all the (fast) freedom you want.
Only thing is: are you sure you'll NEVER want to visit another satellite? You could leave the motor in place, just in case you do.
I have more or less the same here: a 4-sat twin LNB fixed dish + a motorised dish (via the same switch). So for "normal"usage I enjoy fast sat-swapping, and once in a while I visit exotic sat's (slower, but reachable).

[qpush]

Regarding the price (Basset), we are talking about 500 euro for the entire setup including work... not cheap but cheaper then the ultimo and like you say, it will be a comfy setup.

Rob, sry... not a one-sat solution.. a one DISH solution :)
I'm pretty sure I wont be visiting any exotic satellites as it didn't happen in in the 2 years I have had the motorized dish... I might just leave it there.. or sell it :)
Thanks

[Larry-G]

Regarding the price (Basset), we are talking about 500 euro for the entire setup including work... not cheap but cheaper then the ultimo and like you say, it will be a comfy setup.

Rob, sry... not a one-sat solution.. a one DISH solution :)
I'm pretty sure I wont be visiting any exotic satellites as it didn't happen in in the 2 years I have had the motorized dish... I might just leave it there.. or sell it :)
Thanks

If your a sports fan it's probably best to keep the motorized dish in case the current providers loose their rights and they move to other locations etc.